All Things End (Season 8 Episodes 14-16)
The 118 has never known a silence like the one fallen here, never watched their future darken in a single tear.
This week, Han, Cil, and Rachel begrudgingly—and not at all angrily— discuss 9-1-1 Season 8 Episode 14 “Sick Day,” Episode 15 “Lab Rats,” and Episode 16 “The Last Alarm.” We’re diving into the emotional turmoil of the latest three episodes, exploring the poignant and gut-wrenching impact of Bobby's death on the characters and the audience.
We share our thoughts on what worked, what didn’t, and how the “creative decisions” impact our viewing experience, especially when it comes to the depth of the characters' emotional responses.
Ultimately, we ask the tough questions: what does it mean to truly honor a character's legacy, and how do we process loss in a narrative that was never structured to do so?
We examine the dynamics at play—how characters cope with loss, the pressures of duty, and the need for connection in the face of tragedy: from Buck’s struggle to hold the team together and Chimney’s personal battle with survivor’s guilt, to Hen’s resilience and Athena’s avoidance and anger. It’s clear that the emotional stakes are high and the characters are grappling not just with the loss of a loved one but also with their own identities and roles within this found family. We lament the lack of screen time for Eddie throughout all three of these episodes and our hopes to see more of his grief journey on screen in the following two.
The caliber of the acting is undeniable! We celebrate the stunning performances, particularly from Angela Bassett, Kenny Choi, and Peter Krause, and the emotional weight they brought to their character’s stories.
There’s a palpable sense of frustration as we critique the show’s pacing and the emotional payoff, or lack thereof, when it comes to the arc of the 9-1-1 Contagion emergency and subsequent funeral. We discuss our thoughts on how major character deaths can have a time and place, this one does not do Bobby’s journey or the audience justice.
When people say that something is forever, either way, it ends. Hopefully we’ll see the foundations of the 118 family begin again.
📝 Fan Works Mentioned
🖋️ What 8x16 Should Have Been, redrosydiaz on tumblr
📔 Articles Mentioned
📰 ‘9-1-1’ Shocker: Original Cast Member Leaving After 8 Seasons, Admits “It’s A Tough Goodbye”, Deadline
📰 ‘911’ Star and Showrunner Unpack a Series-Altering Death in “Lab Rats”, The Hollywood Reporter
📰 ‘9-1-1’: Tim Minear Explains Bobby’s Death & Reveals How Everyone Will Be Grieving, TV Insider
📰 ‘9-1-1’ Creator Breaks Down Show’s First Big Death and Choosing ‘the Scariest Character to Kill’, The Wrap
📰 9-1-1 boss on shocking main character death: If it's really their last episode, and the Easter egg we missed, Entertainment Weekly
📰 9-1-1's Kenneth Choi tearfully processes Bobby's 'devastating' death: 'This doesn't make any sense' (exclusive), Entertainment Weekly
We are @buddiesystempod everywhere:
Watch The Buddie System podcast episodes and our live reactions to the most recent 9-1-1 episodes on YouTube!
Support us on Patreon or Ko-Fi for perks and extra content like access to our exclusive Discord, Fire Fam Chats, New 9-1-1 Episode Livestreams, and more!
The Buddie System is a Nerdvergent Media production.
Music by DIV!NITY
Chapters
(00:00:00) Intro
(00:00:55) Welcome to Dispatch
(00:04:31) A Very Sarcastic Recap
(00:06:37) General Thoughts
(00:15:29) How Could Contagion Arc Be Satisfying?
(00:21:35) Flashover - Themes
(00:25:31) Who’s Cookin’? - Character Highlights
(00:25:50) Karen
(00:29:04) Hen
(00:32:55) Ravi
(00:37:01) Chimney
(00:49:40) Maddie
(00:54:31) Athena
(01:03:24) Athena’s Stages of Grief - Denial & Anger
(01:12:17) Bobby (R.I.P.)
(01:21:11) Buck
(01:33:38) Eddie & Buddie
(01:42:48) What Worked For Us!
(01:50:00) What Didn’t Work For Us…
(02:12:57) Production & Behind the Scenes
(02:19:20) Needle Drop
(02:22:20) What’s Next for Season 8?
(02:25:14) Our Wish List for Finale
(02:33:32) Potential for a Big Buddie Moment
(02:42:36) Outro & Take a Buddie With You
Transcript
This week we talk about how these episodes exist and we watched them.
Speaker B:How the Bobby death of it all affects the characters and us, on screen and off.
Speaker C:And what worked for us and what didn't.
Speaker C:Spoiler alert, the latter is longer.
Speaker A:Have you ever watched something that completely rewired your brain chemistry?
Speaker C:A procedural network drama might not be your usual pick, but it's ours.
Speaker B:This is the Buddy System, a 911 deep dive podcast hosted by three friends who have DM'd each other enough character dissertations to earn a PhD in media literacy.
Speaker A:I'm Han, coming to you straight from the characters heads.
Speaker C:I'm Syl, bringing you to the observation deck.
Speaker B:And I'm Rachel, connecting the dots with my red string.
Speaker B:With our powers combined, no stone is left unturned and no buddy is left behind.
Speaker C:This episode brought to you by no grave can hold our Bobby down.
Speaker C:Welcome to the Buddy System.
Speaker A:This is our latest special covering season 8.
Speaker A:Today we are talking about season 8, episode 14, sick day.
Speaker A:Written by Lindsey Beaulio and Taylor Wong.
Speaker A:Directed by Carla Braun.
Speaker B:We're also talking about season eight, episode 15, titled Lab Rats.
Speaker B:It was written by Kristin Riedel, Molly Greene and James Leffler.
Speaker B:And it was directed by Dawn Wilkinson.
Speaker C:And we'll also be talking about season eight, episode 16, titled the Last.
Speaker C:So wrong.
Speaker C:All wrong.
Speaker A:Last hurrah.
Speaker C:Last hurrah.
Speaker B:Oh, my God.
Speaker A:That was a Freudian slip.
Speaker B:Whoops.
Speaker A:The last we in the woo.
Speaker B:The last we that ever wooed.
Speaker B:That was a great mistake though.
Speaker A:It was.
Speaker C:Hold on.
Speaker B:The last.
Speaker C:Okay.
Speaker B:I love when you get the giggles.
Speaker A:It's always here.
Speaker A:Okay.
Speaker B:Okay.
Speaker C:And we'll be discussing season eight, episode 16, even though we don't want to.
Speaker B:I don't want to discuss any of this.
Speaker B:Just for the record.
Speaker C:Let the record show that I didn't.
Speaker A:Want to do this episode.
Speaker B:We're holding ourselves captive.
Speaker A:This is a hostage situation.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker C:Thanks, Tim.
Speaker C:You, Tim.
Speaker C:Anyway, we're discussing season eight, episode 16.
Speaker B:No, I don't think I will.
Speaker C:Okay.
Speaker C:All right.
Speaker C:I'm like literally psyching myself up just to fucking get this out of the way.
Speaker B:All right.
Speaker C:And we'll be discussing season eight, episode 16, titled the Last.
Speaker A:There's nothing wrong with you.
Speaker A:There's a lot wrong with this situation.
Speaker B:What does hen say?
Speaker A:She's like, everything's wrong with this wrong.
Speaker B:This really is cursed.
Speaker A:Truly.
Speaker B:That wasn't even a self fulfilling prophecy.
Speaker B:That was just like.
Speaker B:It is what it is.
Speaker A:It just is.
Speaker C:Alarm.
Speaker C:Alarm.
Speaker C:Titled the Last Alarm.
Speaker B:That was so aggressive.
Speaker B:The last alarm Ring, ring, mother.
Speaker B:Ring, ring.
Speaker C:What is.
Speaker B:This is what we do.
Speaker B:We're sad, so we're going to be silly.
Speaker A:If the show won't be silly goofy, we will.
Speaker A:Fine.
Speaker C:We'll do it ourselves.
Speaker B:We will.
Speaker C:Okay.
Speaker C:Okay.
Speaker C:Okay.
Speaker A:I'm not gonna look at you until you're done.
Speaker C:Okay.
Speaker C:Season 8 okay.
Speaker A:Do it.
Speaker C:Season 8 Episode 16 titled the Last Alarm Titled the Last Alarm Written by Written by Tim Minear that Man Part 2 Tim Mynier Tim Written by Batman Tim My near that Man.
Speaker B:TM that Man.
Speaker C:Written by Tim Minear and Kristen Rydell Directed by John J.
Speaker C:Gray that was terrible.
Speaker C:Anyway.
Speaker B:No, it was amazing.
Speaker C:Okay, and so it's time for a very sarcastic recap.
Speaker C:That's your intro.
Speaker B:This is what you missed on Glee 911 edition.
Speaker C:So an evil redhead plays God and sets a lab on fire when she gets caught sealing her miracle cure for a big pharma capitalism payday.
Speaker C:The 118 who answered the emergency call get trapped and become lab rats while the government steps in and does nothing helpful.
Speaker A:While hen suffered a collapsed lung but magically doesn't get exposed.
Speaker A:And Chimney contracted the virus.
Speaker A:Athena and Buck have to take loopholes into their own hands and chase down Moira in the miracle cure in a bedazzled Stanley cup with the help of the smartest person on the show, Karen and the Kirkland knockoff of Eddie Tommy to deliver the one dose of antiviral.
Speaker A:Because of course to Chimney, Bobby sacrifices.
Speaker B:Himself just like Jesus when he reveals that he also contracted the virus and says his goodbyes to Buck and Athena.
Speaker B:We flash forward two weeks while everyone starts dealing with their own grief off screen.
Speaker B:Because why would the audience want to see the 118 lean on each other?
Speaker B:And none more so than Athena, who is hallucinating Nate Fisher, I mean Bobby's ghost.
Speaker B:And pours herself into a case that giveth us hope and then taketh away.
Speaker C:Chimney is big mat running around with barely salvaged organs.
Speaker C:Bug seems like he's trying to hold everyone together.
Speaker C:And just like the Avengers begin to assemble for a funeral a little too late, I might add.
Speaker C:Eddie makes his blink and you'll miss it.
Speaker C:MCU cameo appearance the crowd cheered the.
Speaker A:Funeral that spoiled Bobby's death and terrorized the citizens of downtown LA for 12 hours.
Speaker A:Lasts five minutes.
Speaker A:So realistic.
Speaker A:And no one from the 118 gives a eulogy.
Speaker A:So in character.
Speaker A:And then Athena sends the Schrodinger's Bobby casket to Minnesota to be buried with his deceased wife and kids.
Speaker A:Because found family am I Right.
Speaker B:The end.
Speaker B:Or is it?
Speaker B:Okay, so that was our very sarcastic recap of the last three episodes.
Speaker B:And now we'll get into some general thoughts.
Speaker B:I know we were.
Speaker B:We originally were going to do episodes 14 and 15 together, but after seeing that, we were like, well, I guess we have to wait for 16 because that's like the culmination of this arc, kind of.
Speaker B:And it's is kind of.
Speaker B:But, like, is it?
Speaker B:I don't know.
Speaker B:And so.
Speaker B:I know.
Speaker B:I know we all have some thoughts.
Speaker B:We'll be very general and brief here.
Speaker A:I don't like it.
Speaker B:I don't like it.
Speaker A:I don't like it.
Speaker B:I don't know.
Speaker A:I might change my mind if Bobby comes back, but I'm 99 sure that he's not.
Speaker A:So I don't like it.
Speaker A:I don't find it enjoyable.
Speaker A:I don't find it very moving.
Speaker A:The parts that I find moving are only because of the acting and my attachment to the characters.
Speaker A:It's not because of the story.
Speaker B:That's a good, like, differentiation.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker C:I.
Speaker C:I avoid it.
Speaker C:I don't like it.
Speaker C:No.
Speaker C:Well, yeah, I don't.
Speaker C:Generally, I don't like it.
Speaker C:I don't like that Bobby's dead.
Speaker C:I honestly have been operating for the past, I guess, month.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:Because we're going to include the 12 hours or so, the poor people of LA.
Speaker C:I mean, honestly.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker B:Month.
Speaker B:Almost month.
Speaker B:Five weeks.
Speaker A:What?
Speaker C:We'll get into that.
Speaker C:Anyway, yeah.
Speaker C:So I've been operating on the hope of getting this.
Speaker C:This fake out.
Speaker C:Because there's no way that this was real considering that this was not a closed set.
Speaker A:And she just said, there's no way that they're all this dumb.
Speaker B:Right?
Speaker B:Oh, I think she did, yeah.
Speaker A:Look at her face.
Speaker A:She's just like.
Speaker B:No, if still says that.
Speaker B:She means it.
Speaker A:Yeah, No, I know.
Speaker C:So anyway, yeah, so, like, literally, I mean, I.
Speaker C:I was operating with there's no way.
Speaker C:And I had avoided re watching these episodes since, you know, since 814 released.
Speaker C:815 released and 8 16.
Speaker C:Well, 8 16, I had to watch it.
Speaker C:Obviously.
Speaker C:I avoided re watching 14 and 15 because I was like, there's.
Speaker C:Why am I gonna do that?
Speaker C:And I rewatched it in preparation for this.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:And I closed.
Speaker C:I'm closed.
Speaker C:I.
Speaker C:I've closed on Bobby Alive maxing at least 90% closed.
Speaker C:Because if Bobby shows up in my screen at 8:59pm I'm sorry, 8:58pm on May 15th.
Speaker C:It is May 15th, right?
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker C:On May 15th, then we're so open for business obviously.
Speaker C:But right now I'm closing and yeah, I don't.
Speaker C:But overall, as far as the, the arc, I mean I was just explaining earlier how if these were characters.
Speaker C:I'm gonna talk about the episodes specifically like the contagion arc.
Speaker C:If these were characters that I did not care about and I was just randomly going to the movie theater to watch a movie like a sci fi thriller, whatever movie of these three episodes.
Speaker B:Of these three episodes as a movie.
Speaker C:I mean I guess it's a.
Speaker C:I guess it could be considered a good movie maybe.
Speaker C:Probably.
Speaker C:I don't know.
Speaker C:But it's.
Speaker C:Again, it's like I'm not attached to if this would be.
Speaker C:If I was not attached to these characters.
Speaker C:But I am so.
Speaker A:I don't know.
Speaker A:Movie.
Speaker C:And it's also not a movie.
Speaker C:But I'm saying what.
Speaker C:My point being.
Speaker A:I get what you're saying.
Speaker B:I, I agree.
Speaker B:I think that if this were a standalone thing with non established characters like released as an entire movie instead of episodically.
Speaker B:Yeah, it's got a beginning, a middle and an end.
Speaker B:The characters are in a different place than where.
Speaker B:Than where they started.
Speaker B:Sure, that works.
Speaker C:Yeah, that works.
Speaker C:I don't know if someone was trying to get like their not directorial debut but I guess like long form kind of story out there that they wanted to do have it released.
Speaker C:Movie theaters anyway.
Speaker C:But I digress.
Speaker C:I hate it.
Speaker C:Rachel.
Speaker B:Yeah, I also don't like it.
Speaker B:I'm.
Speaker B:And it's so hard I.
Speaker B:I think to.
Speaker B:For me to discuss these three episodes and my.
Speaker B:Not only my feelings on it but like where I think we're going to.
Speaker B:Going to go.
Speaker B:Because I think it's so contingent like my, my actual opinions on this are so contingent on the last two episodes of the season because that will.
Speaker B:In hindsight I think that will help contextualize a lot for me in ways that I'll be able to say, okay, I now understand the purpose of this whatever whichever pieces it may be.
Speaker B:So I can understand the logic of how you got from how you started at point A and got to point B.
Speaker B:I don't know where point B is.
Speaker B:So I'm just kind of like looking at it as these three episodes.
Speaker B:I have to like in, in our analysis of it.
Speaker B:I'm going to be looking at it at it through a lens of like Bobby is dead.
Speaker B:I don't actually believe that, but I'm going to be looking at it because again I don't have the rest of the context for it.
Speaker B:I can't Believe I'm the last hold out of the Bobby is alive maxing out of all of us.
Speaker B:But I'm still like, I can't believe that either.
Speaker B:I'm still there.
Speaker B:I'm just.
Speaker B:I'm just mostly.
Speaker B:I'm just mostly, like, kind of frustrated, aggravated, and a little numb to the whole contagion arc.
Speaker B:And I'm including 16 in with this, even though it was technically the two parter, because the funeral is like the conclusion of that whole thing.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:So I just not super excited to see how or to see what happens next.
Speaker B:I'm hoping we can pull up from this, but everything is so contingent on each other that I'm just like, I literally don't have any other opinions other than like, yeah, I'm frustrated.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker C:It's kind of like, where is this plane going?
Speaker C:And who's flying the plane?
Speaker B:Because Athena was flying it at the beginning of the season and that turned out just fine.
Speaker B:But I don't think she's.
Speaker B:I don't think she's in the cockpit anymore.
Speaker C:No.
Speaker B:I think it's the ghost of Bobby.
Speaker A:They put her back on a cruise ship and a plane in the same season.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:And took away another love.
Speaker A:And took away another love of her life.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:So that's.
Speaker B:That's where I am right now.
Speaker B:I.
Speaker B:I am looking forward to being able to do the season eight wrap and really, like, diving into more of how I actually feel about this stuff from.
Speaker B:From like a big picture sort of thing.
Speaker B:Because I.
Speaker B:Because I often, like, if I look at it like more zoomed in, I get irritated and frustrated about how things are handled.
Speaker B:If I look at it from a more zoomed out, big picture sort of thing, I can, you know, like, I'm.
Speaker A:Afraid if he's really dead, I'm going to be even angrier at that point.
Speaker A:After, like, rewatching everything again and seeing how.
Speaker A:And I did just rewatch all of 8A before 8B started.
Speaker B:You did.
Speaker A:So, yeah.
Speaker A:Doing it again and being like, here are all the things that you led us to believe that this was happening.
Speaker A:And then if that is not what actually ends up happening, which I don't believe it is right now.
Speaker B:Why.
Speaker B:I mean, for me, like, oftentimes and.
Speaker B:And I say this all the time with, with Endgame, it's like from a.
Speaker B:From a zoomed out, big picture kind of view, I have a different opinion on it than when I zoom into the actual, like, structure of the movie itself.
Speaker B:Like, when I look at it as a whole, as part of, like, the Multiverse.
Speaker B:Not the multiverse.
Speaker B:The what?
Speaker B:Saga.
Speaker C:Infinity.
Speaker B:Infinity.
Speaker B:Saga.
Speaker B:God.
Speaker B:It's been a long time.
Speaker B:When I look at it as a whole, I have a different opinion on Endgame than when I look at End Game, like, in particular, and the story structure there.
Speaker B:So I wouldn't be surprised if I have that kind of feeling with season eight versus the Contagion arc.
Speaker B:But I also wouldn't be surprised if, when we're looking at it from a big picture view with all of, like, the foreshadowing and everything, that I feel the same way.
Speaker B:So that's.
Speaker B:That's where I am.
Speaker B:I just don't know.
Speaker A:Quick question and then we got to move on.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Do you think if on.
Speaker A:On Priscilla and I.
Speaker A:The off chance or the chance this chance that is still there?
Speaker A:I guess because we haven't seen 17 or 18 yet.
Speaker B:No.
Speaker A:That Bobby is alive.
Speaker A:Will this be a satisfying story to you then?
Speaker B:To me?
Speaker A:To.
Speaker A:Yeah, everyone.
Speaker A:What are your individual, like, feelings about that?
Speaker A:Because right now, like, we're running off the assumption, even though you're not closing on the maxing, you're still looking at it like he's gone.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:So we're looking at it like he's gone and saying we don't like it.
Speaker A:But if we were going to.
Speaker A:To just.
Speaker A:Just in case he is alive, would we think that that is now a good story or one that we enjoy?
Speaker C:I have to think about it because.
Speaker C:Yeah, I would have to think about it because of the.
Speaker C:I don't know if I.
Speaker C:Like, here's what I.
Speaker C:Here's where.
Speaker C:Where.
Speaker C:Here's where I started to look at a big picture.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker C:Because of the whole, like, government interference that we've introduced this season.
Speaker C:And I'm like, I don't want that in my weboo show.
Speaker C:It's kind of odd to have, like.
Speaker B:Like, it doesn't fit.
Speaker C:It doesn't fit.
Speaker C:It's.
Speaker C:It's just weird.
Speaker C:So I have to think about that.
Speaker C:And.
Speaker C:And then.
Speaker C:And it's not only.
Speaker C:And I feel like my.
Speaker C:When you say story, you just specifically talking about Bobby's story, are you saying.
Speaker A:Like, talking about the Contagion arc?
Speaker A:Are you going to find.
Speaker A:Are you gonna find 14 through the end of the season or these three episodes that we're saying we don't like?
Speaker A:Like I said, are you gonna find them if he ends up being alive?
Speaker A:Are the things that we hate about it how it was done, all the things leading us to believe that he was actually gonna survive?
Speaker A:Like, if that changes and he's actually alive.
Speaker A:Will that change your opinion of the episodes?
Speaker C:I think that as far as where I stand right now, the contagion story is so out of pocket.
Speaker A:I mean, it is.
Speaker A:It always was gonna be.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker C:It's just so weird.
Speaker C:So I.
Speaker C:I already don't like it.
Speaker C:But I mean, I do like the.
Speaker C:What I do like.
Speaker C:And I.
Speaker C:And I think this is.
Speaker C:This is in general of what I would Normally like about 911 is like all of the little Easter eggs planted too.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker C:To.
Speaker C:In gathering all that evidence that.
Speaker B:To get us.
Speaker C:To get us to the place and prove that he's alive.
Speaker C:That I do like.
Speaker C:So it's just.
Speaker B:It's.
Speaker B:We.
Speaker C:It's kind of like a.
Speaker C:You know, it's.
Speaker C:There's this that I don't like, but I also like this, what they did here.
Speaker C:So it's.
Speaker C:It's kind of.
Speaker C:I'd have to think about it.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:For me, I think it would a little bit depend on how he is brought back.
Speaker B:You know, whether it's through like this government, you know, them actually holding onto their body and this being just another fake out.
Speaker B:I think that would play a part in it.
Speaker B:So I don't think I could really answer that until like we see something.
Speaker B:But I think that would help improve my opinion of these three episodes.
Speaker B:In hindsight, I.
Speaker B:I would still maintain, you know, like in.
Speaker B:In present when as we're experiencing it, like this is how we're feeling.
Speaker B:So, like that's.
Speaker B:That's valid.
Speaker B:But I think in hindsight that will help bring these up by a lot.
Speaker B:Especially like Syl was saying with some of the foreshadowing stuff, which just does not make sense to me otherwise.
Speaker B:But also because that would be to me a kind of more satisfying full circle moment for Bobby's character as an entire whole, like for throughout eight seasons than just sacrificing himself and dying.
Speaker B:It's more satisfying to me to have him make a sacrifice like that and absolve himself of everything that he's done that's.
Speaker B:That's weighed him down so long, like Atlas, like we always talk about, and then have him come out the other side like reborn, lighter, able to actually enjoy his life.
Speaker B:And I think that would be such a more beautiful story for his character.
Speaker B:And on that aspect, I would absolutely be able to see these three episodes in a much better light because that was the final absolution that Bobby had to give himself.
Speaker B:And I would look at it that way.
Speaker B:Everything else, I'm just like, if.
Speaker B:If he's dead.
Speaker A:Dead.
Speaker B:Like, I have to look at all of these through a very removed critical lens and I don't like doing that.
Speaker B:I don't like, like removing the emotion from it too much because otherwise I will get like, worked up.
Speaker B:So that's, that's kind of what I would think.
Speaker B:What about for you, Han?
Speaker A:I don't know.
Speaker A:I truly don't.
Speaker B:I have a question.
Speaker B:Saying.
Speaker A:I've been saying like, you know, in our livestreams after the episodes and in our grief episode that, like, I think it would be a really good gotcha.
Speaker A:It would be a really good fake out.
Speaker A:But I think thinking that it would be a really good fake out versus am I going to enjoy those episodes are separate things.
Speaker B:Oh, 100.
Speaker A:Yeah, that's.
Speaker B:I don't.
Speaker A:I don't know.
Speaker A:I really don't.
Speaker A:Just because I'm so angry right now.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker A:I can't even picture enjoying them.
Speaker A:I'd have to revisit it.
Speaker A:I don't.
Speaker A:I really don't think I'd be able.
Speaker B:To re watch the episodes, but I would look back on them slightly with an improved.
Speaker A:See, I'd be able to re watch them.
Speaker A:I would actually want to re watch them and be like, can I now experience emotion about this?
Speaker A:Because that isn't just anger.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker A:So I don't know.
Speaker A:I guess ask me if he is alive if my opinion changes.
Speaker B:Oh, yeah, we'll.
Speaker B:We'll have to come back to this question like in the season wrap or two or two.
Speaker B:18.
Speaker B:8.
Speaker B:18.
Speaker B:Yeah, whatever.
Speaker A:Or I guess, yeah, we'll have to come back to it and see if our opinion changes at all with what happens in the next two episodes.
Speaker A:But for me, 16 made how I felt about 14 and 15 worse.
Speaker A:Worse.
Speaker A:Much worse if he's actually dead.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Did not, did not enjoy how that was handled.
Speaker A:But anyway, enough of that.
Speaker B:There are some themes.
Speaker C:Oh, where?
Speaker A:Oh yeah.
Speaker C:Flashover.
Speaker A:Go ahead, Rachel, you're on the clock.
Speaker B:Okay.
Speaker B:I couldn't really find any.
Speaker B:I mean, I was the one that didn't actually re watch these episodes.
Speaker B:I like on two times speed our live reactions to it.
Speaker B:And I was mostly just like looking at us just to like remind myself a little bit.
Speaker B:But I was just like, I don't feel like watching these anyways.
Speaker B:So without having rewatched them because I made all these notes without rewatching Doubt, these might be more themes for me.
Speaker B:I don't know.
Speaker B:Like, like themes of Rachel while watching the show.
Speaker B:Doubt.
Speaker B:Because there's the whole.
Speaker B:I mean, obviously in 8:14.
Speaker B:It's like Buck's line, doubt will eat at you like a virus.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:But like doubt in yourself.
Speaker B:Doubt in yourself.
Speaker B:Doubt in, you know, everything.
Speaker B:Doubt in the show.
Speaker B:It's fine mostly, I think, like doubting yourself.
Speaker B:Then there's kind of like this theme we kept seeing about retreating.
Speaker B:So like falling back from like a couple of those.
Speaker B:Like the big bus crash emergency and Bobby was telling everyone, you know, like, fall back, fall back.
Speaker B:And then the army was retreating and falling back when they were like, nope, sorry, can't do anything about it.
Speaker B:So something about like removing oneself from.
Speaker B:From the scenario, I guess, which is something that I would like to do.
Speaker B:Remove myself from this.
Speaker A:I like to be excluded from this narrative.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker B:There's also a theme of one person making executive decisions.
Speaker B:So you've got Moira making her own decision to do all that stuff with the virus.
Speaker B:And you've got Bobby making his executive decision to sacrifice himself.
Speaker B:Athena making executive decisions about taking.
Speaker B:Taking the case into her own hands and trying to remove herself or retreat herself from making executive decisions about the funeral.
Speaker B:You've got Ravi making executive decisions about, like, you know, keep doing what he's doing and, you know, baby's first federal crime.
Speaker B:And then Chimney making executive decisions like calling the government and pestering them.
Speaker B:There's also some season themes about fake outs and twists.
Speaker B:Why that.
Speaker B:Why that switch up with the bird with the.
Speaker B:The gender reveal kick at the beginning.
Speaker B:Why the.
Speaker B:The switcheroo with the.
Speaker B:With the baby caskets and it's empty.
Speaker B:I don't know.
Speaker B:These are all twists.
Speaker B:Do they mean anything?
Speaker B:Only time will tell.
Speaker B:And then we also have support systems and found family and maybe like the fracturing of them where they're supposed to be, but it's not really working at the moment.
Speaker B:So in with.
Speaker B:With that, there's also communication or avoidance of communication and transparency or lack of transparency and stuff like that.
Speaker B:And then obviously the stages of grief and the secret sixth stage, which is one of our.
Speaker B:One of our Discord members and.
Speaker B:And it was Carter on the live stream.
Speaker A:One of the funniest people alive.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker B:Truly, the sixth stage of grief is just bamboozlement.
Speaker B:Like, I feel like that's how.
Speaker B:That's the stage that we've entered.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:So stages of grief.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:We're being bamboozled.
Speaker A:We just aren't 100.
Speaker A:Sure.
Speaker A:In which way.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:So those were the themes of the episode.
Speaker B:I apologize.
Speaker B:They're not as deep as they usually are.
Speaker B:But that's what I.
Speaker B:That's the takeaway.
Speaker A:It's okay.
Speaker A:Allegedly, Bobby's deep enough for all of.
Speaker B:Us, so he's been deeper.
Speaker A:He has, but he survived, man.
Speaker C:You're getting kicked out.
Speaker A:What, I'm not allowed to use gallows humor as a coping mechanism?
Speaker A:Who's cooking?
Speaker A:You guys want to hear about, like, character arcs?
Speaker A:I guess they exist, I guess on screen, some of them.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Anyway, let's talk about Karen.
Speaker B:Let's talk with the smartest person in.
Speaker C:The room, the rocket scientist.
Speaker B:Finally letting.
Speaker B:Being let in on the action.
Speaker A:They went.
Speaker A:We need.
Speaker A:We need a scientist.
Speaker A:Oh, wait, we know one.
Speaker B:We've got one of those.
Speaker A:Tell us how your brains work.
Speaker A:Translate this for us.
Speaker B:Literal rocket scientists.
Speaker B:Yeah, brains.
Speaker B:Like, hello.
Speaker B:Yeah, she was great.
Speaker B:I love.
Speaker B:I love that they brought her into.
Speaker B:To their schemes, you know?
Speaker B:And let's be real.
Speaker B:Karen is the best getaway car driver that anybody could want.
Speaker B:Like, it makes total sense.
Speaker B:She.
Speaker B:She's perfect for that.
Speaker B:I think she's also who I would choose to be my getaway driver.
Speaker A:I think that's very valid.
Speaker C:It's very unsuspecting.
Speaker C:Did not expect that.
Speaker B:I loved it.
Speaker B:See?
Speaker C:What a fake out.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:What a fake out.
Speaker B:I.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:So I love that she was just there and involved and used her.
Speaker B:Her smart lady brains to figure out stuff about Moira and how Moira had, like, this weird God complex and.
Speaker B:And her grandeur.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker C:Who her inspirations were.
Speaker A:I.
Speaker A:I did, like, when they first got there and they're sitting down and, like, telling her what.
Speaker A:What's happening.
Speaker A:And Buck is like, yeah, but Hen's okay.
Speaker A:Literal rocket scientist.
Speaker A:Karen is like.
Speaker A:She's locked in a Tier 4 lab with a novel virus and no cure.
Speaker A:That doesn't sound okay.
Speaker B:Like, I love.
Speaker A:I love you book, but she's a.
Speaker A:She's a rocket scientist.
Speaker B:Believe the rocket scientist.
Speaker B:She's.
Speaker B:She's not an immunologist or anything like that, but, like, she probably could be if she wanted to.
Speaker C:She's also the one who delivered the line.
Speaker C:Yes.
Speaker A:We need to thank God that only one of them's sick.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:Ooh.
Speaker C:Foreshadow our shadow.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Yeah, that was pretty obvious.
Speaker B:So, like, that's.
Speaker B:That's basically like, the role that she has in 14 and 15, but then in 16, we get a brief moment where we.
Speaker B:We see her as Hen's emotional support, which I do always love to see.
Speaker B:I love to see how Hen and Karen lean on each other.
Speaker B:Like, I know the waters are rocky with them occasionally, but when.
Speaker B:Like, when they're good, they're so Good.
Speaker B:And they have, like, fantastic communication about stuff like that.
Speaker B:And they, like.
Speaker B:They will also just, like, put everything down and just be there for the other when.
Speaker B:When they need.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Like, they have each other's backs, if you will.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Like, when Karen comes in and asks, like, you know, what.
Speaker B:What purse or whatever to.
Speaker B:To go with her outfit for the funeral, and.
Speaker B:And it's like.
Speaker B:It's a really inconsequential question to ask, but it's like, one of those things that's just like, what can you do?
Speaker B:You're getting ready for a funeral.
Speaker B:Like, ooh.
Speaker B:And.
Speaker B:But she.
Speaker B:She notices immediately how Hen is feeling and just, like, drops it all and comforts her.
Speaker B:And I think that's.
Speaker B:That just shows their.
Speaker B:Their strength as a couple.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Anything else?
Speaker A:I don't think so.
Speaker B:Great.
Speaker B:Next.
Speaker A:Hen, you are unconscious for most of this.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Like an episode and a half.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:When we.
Speaker A:When we said that Pen hadn't had.
Speaker B:An NDE yet, this is not what we meant.
Speaker A:This is not like what we meant.
Speaker A:We didn't mean for her to be just, like, unconscious during the whole thing.
Speaker A:We like NDEs where there's, like, character growth.
Speaker B:You can't really have character growth when you're unconscious.
Speaker A:Unconscious.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Like, forwarding their plots forward.
Speaker A:I don't think it forwarded anyone else's forward either.
Speaker A:It was just an obstacle in a giant room of obstacles.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:It was like their escape room.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Bro.
Speaker A:I don't even know.
Speaker A:I don't even know what to say about her in this.
Speaker A:She's just unconscious, and then she's sad.
Speaker A:Like.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Like, when she's.
Speaker B:When she is conscious, she, like, Karen is using her big brain, her Dr.
Speaker B:Wilson brain, with teaming up with Maddie over the phone at dispatch to help save Chimney.
Speaker B:So, like, I love that team up between Hen and Maddie because you have the almost doctor and the nurse, and especially to like, emphasize how close the.
Speaker B:The Wilsons and the Hans have gotten.
Speaker B:I think that was just, like, another.
Speaker B:Another great moment for how both of their nuclear families have kind of, like, blended into each other in, like, one bigger, like, family, like, subsection of the 118 family.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:So I.
Speaker B:I did like that.
Speaker B:I love when our characters are smart.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:And then.
Speaker B:But that was.
Speaker B:That was kind of it for 14 and 15 because, again, she was unconscious for, like, an episode and a half.
Speaker A:But we don't get that much in 16 either.
Speaker A:She's just.
Speaker A:No, I mean, I think she's dealing with grief the way I think most people would imagine.
Speaker A:Dealing with grief, which is you're sad, you have bouts of crying, but you are kind of like, I do.
Speaker A:It's been two weeks.
Speaker A:Most people aren't, like, also gravely injured when they're dealing with grief, but.
Speaker B:Yes, but she had to be like, yeah, focus on.
Speaker B:Focusing on both grieving and her recovery.
Speaker B:And that's like a double whammy.
Speaker A:But.
Speaker A:But I.
Speaker A:I know a lot of people at a certain point are like, okay, I need to, like, I need to go back to work now or need to get back to usual things.
Speaker A:So I'm not.
Speaker A:I need a distraction to, like, not always be thinking about this.
Speaker A:So I think she's, like, the best example of, like, how to process.
Speaker A:How to process healthily, probably, that we're seeing.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker C:I feel like she's the most pragmatic one out of all of them.
Speaker B:Oh, yeah.
Speaker A:I mean, almost always, generally.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:But she does, like, one of the reasons that she wants to get back to work is because the boys.
Speaker B:The boys are coming back to work today, so she.
Speaker B:She has to be with them.
Speaker B:And I'm just.
Speaker B:I love that because it shows, like, that camaraderie between.
Speaker B:Between them and how she wants to be there for them, too.
Speaker B:It's a shame that we don't really get to see it.
Speaker B:All of them, like, grieving together.
Speaker B:I mean, I know Tim said that he.
Speaker B:There's going to be a lot of, like, fracturedness between the 118, but it, like.
Speaker B:And I'm hoping we'll get to see that in the next two episodes.
Speaker B:So, like, I'm willing to.
Speaker B:To pass judgment on that.
Speaker B:But.
Speaker A:But yeah, she.
Speaker B:She wants to be there to support Chimney and Ravi and Buck, who are also coming back.
Speaker B:And I.
Speaker B:I think it's.
Speaker B:I think it really does show that, like, when.
Speaker B:When someone like Hen has a good support system with Karen, Hen is also then able to be a good support system for others.
Speaker B:So, like the boys, but also Athena, when Athena breaks down eventually.
Speaker B:And.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:And Hen is there as well, so it's like a pay it forward sort of thing, but we don't really see anything else.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:All right, let's get into Robbie.
Speaker B:We love Robbie so much.
Speaker A:Who had the most character development in this arc.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Which, like, it does show that you can do a lot with a little.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:Because, you know, at the beginning of 14, after the bus crash and call and everything, and he almost missed the.
Speaker B:Or he did miss the.
Speaker B:The little baby dude.
Speaker B:That's the second baby in three episodes that was there.
Speaker B:What?
Speaker B:That was not There.
Speaker B:But there.
Speaker B:Sorry, just occurred to me.
Speaker A:Recount the three real things that will drive you crazy.
Speaker B:No, just in three episodes.
Speaker A:Two and three episodes.
Speaker A:So it's like he didn't think there was a baby in the car.
Speaker A:Baby in the car.
Speaker B:And it's the opposite.
Speaker A:You thought there was a baby in the casket, but there wasn't a baby in the casket.
Speaker B:All of these fake outs.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Anyways, so he's really beating himself up for missing that.
Speaker B:And if it wasn't for Bobby, you know, it would have been a much worse outcome.
Speaker B:So he's.
Speaker B:He's doubting and he's blaming himself and he wants to quit.
Speaker B:And, like, his confidence and sense of purpose are so knocked down.
Speaker B:And I feel like we did see this before with him when he, like, was.
Speaker B:Went over and spent some time back at the academy and everything like that.
Speaker B:And it's.
Speaker B:I think it shows, like, how he's still so green to firefighting and he's still trying to, like, navigate things, but by.
Speaker B:By, what was it, 14 or 15 when he.
Speaker B:When he commits baby's first federal crime and goes against.
Speaker A:That was 14.
Speaker B:14.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:When he goes against direct orders from the army guy.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:And, you know, Bobby was probably was going to go do the thing and check on the.
Speaker B:The antiviral for him, and Ravi was just like, no, I'm gonna do it.
Speaker B:I'm here.
Speaker B:So it's that.
Speaker B:That gaining of confidence for him again.
Speaker B:And that was.
Speaker B:That was really sweet.
Speaker B:Like, like a way to, like, put.
Speaker B:Put himself forward.
Speaker A:I think he was trying to redeem himself.
Speaker A:To be honest with you, I don't think we're done seeing Robbie crash out because we didn't really get to see Robbie's grief at all.
Speaker A:And if they choose to show that, which I hope we do, I think it's gonna be even worse because they set that up with.
Speaker A:Oh, if you think about it, I almost got him killed too.
Speaker B:Bobby.
Speaker A:And then if he looks back on this, which I'm sure they all are looking back at the entire call and being like, what could I have done?
Speaker A:The reason that they weren't all out of the lab was because he was still looking for Moira because he didn't want to leave someone behind because he.
Speaker B:Was trying to redeem himself.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker B:For that too.
Speaker A:So I think if they.
Speaker A:If they do it right, we should be seeing a much larger Ravi crash out from this.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:So, like, by the end of 14, it seemed like, like there was some forward movement for that as well.
Speaker B:But I Think the events of 15 just brought him.
Speaker B:Brought him right back kind of to.
Speaker B:To where he was.
Speaker B:And especially we see that kind of like, he's.
Speaker B:He's not very sure footed again.
Speaker B:And.
Speaker B:And he's looking to others for that guidance, someone to lean on.
Speaker B:So he's.
Speaker B:He's kind of like leaning on Buck.
Speaker B:He's leaning on Eddie.
Speaker B:Like, he asks Eddie about, like, you know, how have you been through something like, like a funeral like this with all this pomp and circumstance because, you know, Eddie has been in the army, Eddie has a Silver Star.
Speaker B:So he's.
Speaker B:He's really like, looking for, I think, that new North Star to guide him a little bit, like someone to look up to and.
Speaker B:And help him through this.
Speaker B:But he has to.
Speaker B:He also has to be able to, like, lean on himself in that way.
Speaker B:Like, like, have confidence in himself, which will take a while to rebuild.
Speaker B:Okay, let's talk about Chimney and encephalitis, part 2.
Speaker B:Electric boogaloo, this time with more organ failure.
Speaker C:Oh, my God, Tim, can you leave this man alone?
Speaker A:I understand being obsessed with Kenny Choi, but, like, there.
Speaker A:Holy.
Speaker B:Can you stop making him sick?
Speaker B:His character sick?
Speaker C:Can we just give him some emotional trauma?
Speaker C:Well.
Speaker B:Well, they're doing that.
Speaker A:We're doing that.
Speaker C:But okay, I'm talking about next season.
Speaker C:Can we not give him an NDE.
Speaker A:To get emotional trauma by the other people that you care about getting hurt?
Speaker C:Yes.
Speaker B:Can we just have, like, a moratorium on, like, physical, like, dangers being put upon Chimney?
Speaker B:Because, like, they start this episode or like, when they're in the lab, when they're in the vents again, and.
Speaker B:And Buck's like, hey, it's just last time you weren't a vet, you contracted encephalitis.
Speaker B:And it's like, why would you bring that up?
Speaker B:First of all, that's terrible.
Speaker B:That's curse.
Speaker B:That's so cursed.
Speaker B:And you're just like, I know it's like foreshadowing, but it just seems too easy.
Speaker B:It's like, well, obviously it's.
Speaker B:It's gonna happen.
Speaker B:Like, that's.
Speaker B:Come on, come on.
Speaker B:It's a good thing.
Speaker B:He's.
Speaker B:He's a modern medical healing miracle marvel.
Speaker B:Chimney Han.
Speaker A:He's.
Speaker A:It's so funny because we're watching in our rewatch right now, we're in the, like, lawsuit era.
Speaker A:And Chimney in the.
Speaker A:In the.
Speaker A:Not deposition.
Speaker C:The arbitration hearing.
Speaker A:The arbitration hearing.
Speaker A:Thank you.
Speaker A:They have to, like, talk about House, how soon they were allowed to be back to work after blah, blah, blah happened and he Was like.
Speaker A:Yeah, it was like a couple weeks.
Speaker A:I'm a fast healer.
Speaker B:He beat his record.
Speaker B:It's only last time.
Speaker B:Last couple times it was a month.
Speaker B:This is only been two years.
Speaker B:Like, wow.
Speaker B:He had to spend a month.
Speaker B:It took him a whole month to get over, like, being stabbed, but he.
Speaker B:He bounced back from organ failure in two weeks.
Speaker B:Wow.
Speaker B:Look at him go.
Speaker C:I wonder what was in that serum.
Speaker C:Super squishy.
Speaker B:Yeah, it might be.
Speaker B:It was blue.
Speaker B:I.
Speaker B:I mean, I wouldn't put.
Speaker B:I wouldn't pass Moira to, like, at this point.
Speaker C:What is realism?
Speaker C:You know what I mean?
Speaker A:I mean, who knows?
Speaker B:Who knows?
Speaker B:We don't have the rule book.
Speaker A:The only thing that I know that Tim considers realism is killing characters.
Speaker A:So that's all I got.
Speaker A:Yep.
Speaker A:So Chimney is d.
Speaker A:Dying again.
Speaker A:And his anxiety this time is about taking care of his family, obviously, but especially because Maddie is about to have their second kid and, like, he'd be leaving her alone with both of the kids and leaving her alone just like, period.
Speaker A:So he has this.
Speaker A:This talk with.
Speaker A:With Bobby to, like, you know, the, like, deathbed, like, please take care of my.
Speaker A:My people.
Speaker A:Or like, promise me.
Speaker B:Yeah, like the, like the brothers in arms in war, like, take care of my girl.
Speaker B:Well, when I'm gone, you know.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:But we do learn that he has.
Speaker A:He does have some anxiety about.
Speaker A:About just, like, being a.
Speaker A:A father to a son because of his own issues with his father, who's a piece of work.
Speaker B:Understatement.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:And he has this, like, really lovely conversation with Bobby about that.
Speaker B:But it's also, like, heartbreaking because he brings up, like, Bobby's kids and just.
Speaker B:That's when I lost it.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:The first time.
Speaker B:So everything else happens.
Speaker B:Chimney gets saved by everyone's efforts.
Speaker B:Hen and Maddie and Athena and Buck and, you know, everyone get.
Speaker B:He gets the.
Speaker B:The antiviral.
Speaker B:The one dose of the antiviral.
Speaker B:And I don't think he's.
Speaker B:He's able to, like, immediately.
Speaker B:He can't even just like, thank God I'm alive.
Speaker B:No, it's like, I'm alive.
Speaker B:Boom.
Speaker B:Bobby's dead.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Like, so him being angry makes a lot of sense to me because I was putting myself in that situation, and I was like, Bobby handled it badly.
Speaker A:I understand him not wanting to tell them, like, when he realized it, but he should have told them after he gave Chimney the.
Speaker A:The shot.
Speaker A:He should have told them and had goodbyes with everyone because he was literally about to let all of them go and not have goodbyes.
Speaker A:With any of them.
Speaker A:And that's not fair to them.
Speaker B:No.
Speaker A:He probably thought he was making it easier for them.
Speaker A:I don't know.
Speaker B:Which.
Speaker B:He's not.
Speaker A:It's so.
Speaker A:But he.
Speaker A:He should know that that's not true, as someone who's experienced, like, unfathomable laws, like you would think, because he wouldn't have even gotten to say goodbye to Buck or Athena if Buck knows that he wasn't right behind him.
Speaker A:So.
Speaker A:Yeah, I would be angry, too.
Speaker A:And I don't think he's angry because he gave him the cure and didn't give him a choice, because I think he knows that, like, that would have been the outcome.
Speaker A:No matter what.
Speaker B:Bobby would have always talked him into it, prioritized his family, his team.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:So, like, I.
Speaker B:I do think Chimney is angry at him for.
Speaker B:For not just not telling.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Not giving him a chance to say goodbye.
Speaker B:Not giving him a chance to say goodbye, but also for not giving them the opportunity to.
Speaker B:To find a different way.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker B:Which.
Speaker B:Which Chimney says when.
Speaker B:When he's up on the rooftop of the station and Buck finds him.
Speaker B:Because Chimney says there's always a third way.
Speaker B:And Bobby told them that.
Speaker B:Like, Bobby taught them that.
Speaker B:But they have to work as a team and put all of their, like, brain power together in order to find that third way.
Speaker B:And because they were so fractured from, like, just physical space, but also, like, you know, some of them were unconscious.
Speaker B:Some of them were recovering from organ failure.
Speaker B:Like, it wasn't.
Speaker B:There wasn't, like, a possib.
Speaker B:There wasn't an option for them to be able to, like, put them.
Speaker B:Put their minds to it and figure out, like, a different solution.
Speaker B:And that's probably, like, one of.
Speaker B:One of the other hardest parts, too, because Chimney, he said that he thought.
Speaker A:About it and they couldn't.
Speaker A:He couldn't think of anything.
Speaker A:Yeah, I.
Speaker A:I see what you're saying, and I agree that he thinks that maybe if they all work together, they maybe could have thought of something.
Speaker A:But I really.
Speaker B:Even if they didn't, because I really think it's because.
Speaker A:Well, we don't know if he got to say goodbye to his mom, but we know that he did not get to say goodbye to Kevin.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker B:So it's just another person taken away from him.
Speaker A:Yeah, it's.
Speaker A:It's the not being able to say goodbye and the fact that Bobby knew that and.
Speaker A:And took that away from him.
Speaker A:I think that's why he's angry.
Speaker B:And I think also a little bit it might be about Bobby, like, not Having trust or.
Speaker B:Or Chimney.
Speaker B:Chimney thinking that Bobby didn't trust him enough with that information.
Speaker B:A little bit.
Speaker C:Well, it.
Speaker C:What Bobby does, he's in.
Speaker C:Which is also something that I've paralleled him doing with like.
Speaker C:Or that Eddie does actually, is the whole, like, taking that choice away without consulting someone.
Speaker C:And, I mean, that is.
Speaker C:That line is actually said by Athena.
Speaker B:Yeah, it's the executive decision.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker C:So, I mean, I would be.
Speaker C:Yeah, I would be angry, too.
Speaker C:I would be angry because you just did not give me an alternative way to even, like, be able to process.
Speaker B:Yeah, that's it.
Speaker C:So.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:So I think Chimney is completely valid in his anger, and it does make me sad that he's trying to kind of, like, run away from his thoughts and just, like, running, running, but also, like, running away from Maddie aft.
Speaker B:Even after everything that they've been through just this season, and the emphasis that they've had on, like, this transparency of communication and how they're feeling.
Speaker B:Like.
Speaker B:Like, it can be.
Speaker B:It can be Maddie's turn for her to support Chimney, you know, like, how Karen is supporting hen.
Speaker B:How Chimney has supported Maddie, but, like, Chimney is kind of not giving her the option or the opportunity to do that either.
Speaker C:Chimney has become the bolter.
Speaker B:A little bit.
Speaker C:A little bit.
Speaker C:That's kind of like that.
Speaker C:There's a bit of a role.
Speaker C:There's a little bit of a role reversal here.
Speaker B:Yeah, I think we keep seeing that, too.
Speaker A:I also think this is a.
Speaker A:Well, obviously, this is all trauma, but I think it's specifically a trauma response of the survivor's guilt that he has.
Speaker A:And I think other than Bobby, he has the worst survivor's guilt.
Speaker A:Yeah, well, Bobby's dead now, allegedly, so he has the worst survivor's guilt of anyone, so.
Speaker B:Hooray.
Speaker A:I hope we start to see him move forward as we start to see other people's grief more, because I.
Speaker A:It's gonna be too much for me.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker A:But, yeah, I get the anger.
Speaker A:The drinking.
Speaker A:I didn't like that.
Speaker B:No.
Speaker A:And I didn't.
Speaker A:I don't say things are out of character.
Speaker A:Like, ever on this podcast that felt out of character to me.
Speaker B:It was a little out of left field.
Speaker B:Like, we never really.
Speaker A:We don't really even see him drinking.
Speaker B:No.
Speaker B:Like, not even really.
Speaker B:Beers.
Speaker B:Like maybe a glass of wine.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Like, maybe.
Speaker A:I don't know.
Speaker A:Have we ever even seen him drunk before?
Speaker B:Karaoke.
Speaker C:Karaoke.
Speaker C:Then they have a party.
Speaker C:Like, were they or something?
Speaker A:I don't know.
Speaker B:They had been.
Speaker B:They had been drinking in the.
Speaker C:Well.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:But we don't see him drinking regularly.
Speaker B:No.
Speaker A:Is the thing.
Speaker A:So I just think showing him coping with alcohol on the roof where Bobby almost killed himself.
Speaker B:Yeah, that was really weird because he's.
Speaker A:Angry at the alcoholic.
Speaker A:Like, that was just.
Speaker B:Yeah, I didn't like that.
Speaker A:I like that.
Speaker B:I.
Speaker B:And also.
Speaker B:And also just, like.
Speaker B:Just to bring in the realism for, like, a quick second.
Speaker A:Okay.
Speaker A:Then we gotta move on to.
Speaker B:Yeah, that's fine.
Speaker B:This is my last point.
Speaker B:The realism of having organ failure.
Speaker B:And then all of a sudden, now you're like a marathon runner two weeks later.
Speaker B:Not even two weeks.
Speaker B:You.
Speaker B:You've already started running before the two weeks, and now you're drinking and you're like, organ failure.
Speaker B:I'm assuming that's most organs, which include your kidneys.
Speaker B:So, like, I'm not sure he'd be able to handle, like, half of a bottle of vodka or whatever that was.
Speaker A:Doesn't alcohol affect your liver?
Speaker A:Not your kidneys?
Speaker B:Sorry, Liver.
Speaker B:I don't know.
Speaker B:Anatomy, science, liver.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker C:My concern.
Speaker C:My concern with that is because I, I.
Speaker C:My trust with the show is a little bit fractured right now.
Speaker C:That they take a dark turn with that if they really wanted to.
Speaker B:Oh, my God, I would hate that.
Speaker B:I would hate that so much.
Speaker C:And.
Speaker B:Yeah, it's like, what kind of a.
Speaker B:Like, honoring Bobby's memory would that be if, like, you turn one of your other characters into, like, an alcoholic to cope?
Speaker B:That's.
Speaker B:That's in such bad taste to me.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:I really hope they don't do that.
Speaker A:Well, that's not.
Speaker A:That's not in Chimney's character.
Speaker A:So shall that.
Speaker A:Shall that come to pass?
Speaker A:We shall deal with it.
Speaker B:Mm.
Speaker B:Well, who knows anymore?
Speaker A:Yeah, I know.
Speaker A:But in this moment, that was just.
Speaker A:I didn't like that one thing, but the rest of his grief, I.
Speaker A:I totally.
Speaker A:Yes, I understood.
Speaker C:Maybe I shouldn't poke it into existence because.
Speaker A:Well, I feel like there's no evil idea we can come up with that hasn't run through the Bob man's head.
Speaker A:But can I just say once again.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Kenny Choi.
Speaker B:Oh, yeah.
Speaker B:Eat that up.
Speaker A:I didn't like these episodes that much, but, like, your acting is always phenomenal, but it was so good in these.
Speaker A:Especially in 16.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:That, like, I think.
Speaker B:I think just, like, blanket statement.
Speaker B:The acting in all of these episodes were the best things about these episodes.
Speaker A:Oh.
Speaker B:Just point blank, like, and by Miles.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:Just miles above everybody's performances.
Speaker B:Fantastic.
Speaker B:Yep.
Speaker B:Especially in 16 with.
Speaker B:With Angela Bassett and Kenny Joy, like.
Speaker C:Yep.
Speaker B:Blew us out of the water.
Speaker C:Two powerhouses right there.
Speaker B:Okay, Maddie.
Speaker A:So Maddie, she's.
Speaker A:She okay except for the rebar.
Speaker A:She's been there to witness like every single time that chimney has almost died.
Speaker B:Gotten this close.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:I think she's.
Speaker A:I would be developing a complex.
Speaker A:Like I'd be putting my husband in bubble wrap.
Speaker B:Well, yeah.
Speaker A:Making them stay home.
Speaker B:And I mean, I think she already developed a kind of part of that complex which was I'm not good for my family.
Speaker B:But we already did that, so.
Speaker B:But Maddie does again team up with Henry for the nurse doctor collab dream team to, to help save her husband.
Speaker B:But also how many times does she have to save her husband?
Speaker B:Yeah, it's like it's been a few times too many.
Speaker C:Anyway, she is super pregnant.
Speaker C:I don't know what the timeline is, but she looks like she's ready to pop.
Speaker B:Cracker's like, whoa.
Speaker A:I mean if she's towards the end of her pregnancy, it does kind of makes sense.
Speaker A:Especially because she's really tiny and he's sort of like.
Speaker A:Because like my, my sister in law who has five children is five feet tall.
Speaker B:So whenever there's all of a sudden like.
Speaker A:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker A:So she'll go looking from like moderately pregnant to oh my God, you're about to give birth.
Speaker A:And like she won't even actually be.
Speaker A:She'll get even bigger.
Speaker A:But because she's so tiny, she looks like she's extraordinarily pregnant.
Speaker B:It's just like such a big change between like it is 8, like 14 when we see her and everyone in their kitchen looking at it, at the, the cake and then just like, whoa.
Speaker B:But it's because we're not there for these two weeks.
Speaker B:So.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Double edged sword.
Speaker A:I think Maddie might have, I mean, other than, you know, the people closest to Bobby.
Speaker A:I think she kind of had it the worst during this thing because it's her brother, it's her husband, it's her.
Speaker B:Like pseudo sister and she's just on the phone and can't do much the entire time.
Speaker B:Yeah, I mean she does what she can, which is why like she and Hen like team up and, and she's on, she's on like WebMD or like Wikipedia or whatever.
Speaker B:Just like looking up all things.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Like chimney actively dying.
Speaker A:Like, I don't know, tell Dr.
Speaker A:Google I'm fine.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:So it's like, like all of the, all of the things about being a dispatch operator where you're only there in, in such a certain capacity and not able to actually help, but also like that's gotta be how everybody on the outside of the lab was feeling too, like Buck and Athena.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:Because.
Speaker B:Because they were essentially, like, in that same kind of position where they couldn't do anything.
Speaker B:So they're gonna find the way for them to be, like, active and supportive and.
Speaker B:And that was how Maddie could do it.
Speaker B:By staying on the phone with them and like.
Speaker B:Like consoling them and.
Speaker B:And helping where she can and like, literally doing her job.
Speaker B:But also it's worse because it's your.
Speaker C:Family and you have to listen to all of that because she can't even, like, see what's happening.
Speaker C:So she.
Speaker C:She could just imagine a horrors.
Speaker C:Maybe it's not as bad, but it's just.
Speaker C:It takes a toll just having to just be there.
Speaker C:Only by listening.
Speaker B:Mm.
Speaker B:And I think we see that it has taken a toll because when Buck comes over in the morning and Maddie's like, because of certain events lately, like, I just want to tell you that I love you more and.
Speaker B:And show, like, physical affection.
Speaker B:And I think.
Speaker B:I think that's like, a really lovely way of coping and like, a beautifully optimistic way that.
Speaker B:That I don't think we've seen some of.
Speaker B:Some of the other characters get to yet, where it's just like, I just want to tell you I love you and make sure you know that and.
Speaker B:And be, like, more effusive about it, more upfront.
Speaker B:So, like, that's a positive thing, but.
Speaker A:It'S one of those things that happens when you're reminded of your mortality and how short your time is with everyone.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:So it's like.
Speaker B:It's not a great reason why you're.
Speaker A:Thinking about that, but I did really, like, just like, on an up note, I guess, to end it.
Speaker A:I did really like that they were, like, going into the facility in 14 and they were like, how are you even gonna, like, manage?
Speaker A:And they were like, we have someone like, she's the man in the chair.
Speaker B:She is.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker A:Her skills, she totally was taught as a dispatcher.
Speaker B:Totally.
Speaker C:Totally.
Speaker C:Realism.
Speaker C:Take a shot.
Speaker C:Every single time I say realism.
Speaker C:Okay.
Speaker C:So anyway, Athena.
Speaker C:I don't even know how to start because she's.
Speaker B:She's doing her Athena thing.
Speaker B:Ain't no feds gonna hold her Bobby down.
Speaker C:Well, she is doing her Athena thing, so she's.
Speaker C:She's being the.
Speaker C:I was gonna say doing the most.
Speaker C:She's.
Speaker C:She's being Athena.
Speaker C:She.
Speaker C:She's Athena.
Speaker C:Athena's gonna do what Athena wants to do.
Speaker C:No one's going to tell her to step down.
Speaker B:What No, I was just saying, like.
Speaker B:Huh.
Speaker C:Oh, I thought you said on.
Speaker C:I'm like, what?
Speaker B:Sorry, I was agreeing with you.
Speaker B:Like, nobody's gonna tell her to step down.
Speaker B:And even if they do, she's gonna.
Speaker C:She's gonna do.
Speaker C:She's gonna do whatever she wants.
Speaker C:So she.
Speaker C:Look, so she.
Speaker C:And she's just.
Speaker C:What was it that she was a.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker C:Oh, right.
Speaker C:You know, she pulls up at the scene.
Speaker C:She's.
Speaker C:She's saying that.
Speaker C:Oh, she's just a regular officer to.
Speaker C:While she's trying to like, scout like Moira's house and all of that, trying to collect any kind of evidence or any kind of clue of where she would have been.
Speaker C:Honestly, this is the Athena that I love.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker C:I wish we had more of that.
Speaker C:The.
Speaker C:The detective, the one that goes against like the.
Speaker C:The ranks, the system.
Speaker B:I think that's when she's at her most effective, honestly.
Speaker C:She is.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker C:And she takes Buck with her.
Speaker A:You know, it's like he has to be babysat.
Speaker C:Yeah, he does.
Speaker A:To be clear.
Speaker A:That's why he's there.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Because like, he will also do his own Buck thing.
Speaker B:But sometimes in this situation.
Speaker B:Not helpful.
Speaker B:No, no, no.
Speaker B:So now he's sidekick Buckley to Athena's detective, which is really cute.
Speaker B:I would love to.
Speaker B:I love that kind of buddy cop when they're hen.
Speaker A:And Karen's.
Speaker C:And yeah.
Speaker A:He's like, she stole the crime scene photos.
Speaker A:And she's like, I'm a police officer.
Speaker A:I simply transferred custody of the evidence.
Speaker C:Always finding those loopholes.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker B:Those third ways.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker A:One might say she lives in the third way.
Speaker A:Basically, this is the way.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:I don't know.
Speaker A:I hate this for Athena.
Speaker A:I hate it so much.
Speaker B:Everything about it.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:I love.
Speaker B:I love how determined she was to hunt down Moira.
Speaker B:I love how effective she was because.
Speaker B:And.
Speaker B:And Buck.
Speaker B:Buck helped.
Speaker B:But I love how they were able to track down Moira.
Speaker B:They were able to.
Speaker B:To fool the army and the FBI and everybody with like a look over there moment and then, you know, basically outsmart the government into saving.
Speaker A:Not a hard thing to do right now.
Speaker B:No.
Speaker B:No.
Speaker B:But she was still really smart about it, so I want to give her props for that.
Speaker B:Government intelligence notwithstanding.
Speaker B:But it's because she knew that this was the right thing to do and she was not going to let like the.
Speaker B:The whole tension between her and the.
Speaker B:The army guy who was in charge at the moment because he told all of his people to retreat because it's like up.
Speaker B:Can't do anything about it, I guess.
Speaker B:They just have to die as heroes.
Speaker B:And you tell Athena Grant that and you think that she's gonna leave it lying down.
Speaker B:Absolutely not.
Speaker B:So, like, also, because it's just like, it's so not right, however you slice it.
Speaker B:And like, inhumane.
Speaker B:So she does the right thing.
Speaker B:She outsmarts the government, she succeeds in her mission, and then all of this.
Speaker C:And yeah, before we get into all of this, I just really love the scene where.
Speaker C:Where Bobby is telling her to go and you're just like.
Speaker C:And.
Speaker C:And you can just tell, like, how they're.
Speaker C:They're understanding each other or they're understanding what they're actually saying as opposed to the words that are actually coming out of their mouths.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker C:So she, like, it's like giving the permission because I know what you're.
Speaker C:It's kind of like, I know what you're going to do.
Speaker C:And she's like, yeah, I'm going to do that.
Speaker C:So love that scene.
Speaker B:Wait, when.
Speaker B:When.
Speaker A:When he's like, you need to go.
Speaker C:You need to go.
Speaker A:Yeah, because he's like.
Speaker A:He's like, you need to go and let them do their jobs.
Speaker A:They're going to find her soon.
Speaker B:Which is like.
Speaker A:Find her before them, basically, is what that was.
Speaker A:And Buck just was not getting it.
Speaker A:When we first watched it, I was like, what is hat?
Speaker A:So I was Buck in that situation because I was, like, not quite understanding what the.
Speaker A:Was happening.
Speaker A:No, it was.
Speaker B:It was absolutely like the Bobby to Athena, like, telecommunication sort of situation, because they just understand each other so well.
Speaker B:And I think one of the other things that we always love is when Athena and Bobby team up and do their little, like, detective thing together as well, because they are so effective and they.
Speaker B:And they work so well together because they are just like equal partners in.
Speaker B:In so much.
Speaker B:And that's his little like, wink, wink, nudge, nudge.
Speaker B:Like, no, you can't do that.
Speaker B:Not at all.
Speaker A:Like, you're too close to it.
Speaker A:You're too close to me.
Speaker A:You need to go close to the thing that we need go do that.
Speaker B:Yeah, I.
Speaker B:I love that.
Speaker A:It's very married behavior.
Speaker B:Because he knows Athena and he knows what she's gonna do.
Speaker C:That was the last bit of Athena joy that we got.
Speaker C:Sorry.
Speaker B:So.
Speaker B:No, I mean, I should think the.
Speaker A:Last time that they.
Speaker A:That her and Bobby did like a detective thing together, I made myself sad.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Treasure hunt.
Speaker C:No, I think there's another one.
Speaker B:There's another one that I can't remember off the top of my head at the moment.
Speaker A:I know there's do we count the cruise ship?
Speaker C:I'm sure.
Speaker A:Because they figured out like that whole thing.
Speaker B:Yeah, I would count that.
Speaker B:I just love when they get to team up with each other and like, use each other's brains.
Speaker B:Again, smart characters.
Speaker C:That's her partner.
Speaker B:So all of the joy gets sucked out of the room really, really quickly because, you know, Buck calls Athena down and they have a.
Speaker B:A final goodbye.
Speaker B:And that whole, that whole speech with.
Speaker B:Between Bobby and Athena, and Athena is just like, refusing to accept.
Speaker B:Refusing to accept it.
Speaker B:Refusing to accept what he wants because he tells her to go, yeah.
Speaker B:And she's just like, no, I'm gonna spend as much time with you together as we have.
Speaker B:Because that's.
Speaker B:Yeah, what I.
Speaker B:That's what she.
Speaker B:She loves him.
Speaker B:And that's their relationship that they're just going to.
Speaker B:I think that is so, like, emblematic of their relationship where it's like all of the time that they have together, they're going to.
Speaker B:They're going to take advantage of.
Speaker B:They're going to make the most of it.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:Because they both had previous marriages.
Speaker B:They both lived like.
Speaker B:Had lived a very experiential life.
Speaker B:Like, they've just been through a lot, both of them.
Speaker B:But one of the joys of them finding each other is just being able to spend that time together, spend the rest of their lives together.
Speaker B:I think they both.
Speaker B:And we thought it would be longer than that, but yeah, so.
Speaker B:So they have like this final moment of connection where we see like, you know, like the Wrath of Khan moment between the glass.
Speaker B:And just like I.
Speaker B:I know in one of the interviews that I was about to say Athena, Angela gave after 15, she was talking about how it was really difficult because they were so like, sequestered, not only like from the other side of the glass, but because of those big, like, suits that you could really only connect through the eyes.
Speaker B:But that.
Speaker B:That kind of made it like all the more powerful for that.
Speaker B:And I think just like another just fantastic acting between both Peter Graza and Angela Bassett, to be able to connect in that way, like so viscerally just through the eyes, because everything else is so obscured, like, of the face.
Speaker B:Like, I think we all really felt that.
Speaker B:So that was like very.
Speaker B:That was very well done on their part.
Speaker B:I want to be clear, just the acting, not the fact that they had to do it, not the fact that they had to do it, but, like.
Speaker A:I want to be clear, the writing that the acting.
Speaker C:Phenomenal thing was phenomenal.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:We expect nothing less.
Speaker B:But yet they continue to Blow our expectations out of the water.
Speaker B:Like, it's just like, oh my God, every time.
Speaker B:So, yeah.
Speaker B:And then in.
Speaker B:And then in episode 16, we see Athena is very much embodying the denial stage and apparently has been for two weeks.
Speaker B:More on that later because she's, she's avoiding the funeral arrangements.
Speaker B:She's avoiding figuring out where they're going to lay Bobby to rest.
Speaker B:She's plunging herself into this case to work because.
Speaker B:And, and I think for like, a couple reasons.
Speaker B:One, it's because.
Speaker B:One of the reasons is because, you know, the, the guy was asking for Bobby, so the case was connected to Bobby, so Athena could feel connected to Bobby.
Speaker B:So I think that was one reason.
Speaker B:The second reason is, you know, what the case was about, which was the, the lack of acceptance of something like that.
Speaker B:And I think she, she really identified with the mother, Leah, for like, not wanting to accept the fate of her child and, and feeling so strongly in the opposite way.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:And I guess the rest of that case was supposed to be about, like, learning to move on, but I don't think that's actually what it.
Speaker B:Like it may have been written to do that.
Speaker B:I don't think it did that.
Speaker B:That's not an Athena thing.
Speaker B:That's.
Speaker B:That's a writing thing.
Speaker B:I have lots of feelings about that.
Speaker B:Oh yeah.
Speaker B:So as she's pouring herself into this case and doing her best, like, detective Athena thing with her, with her red string wall and wall of crazy, as hen says it, which is again, us seeing Athena be her most effective is when she's on, when she's on the case, when she's being a detective Athena.
Speaker B:And I really loved being able to see how.
Speaker B:See her process for that because I don't think, I think we said this while we were watching.
Speaker B:We don't really get to see her like, process stuff like visually on, on a wall, on a board sort of thing and kind of like follow her thoughts in that way, which I really loved.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker C:And I really wish that they would like, show us, I guess, a little bit more.
Speaker C:I don't know the difference between what we saw in 8, 10 and what we saw here is pretty made, I think an improvement.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker C:I don't know what, how I want to say this, but yeah, I guess an improvement because, like, she was able to, to figure out and piece things together.
Speaker C:But it is unfortunately also sad because that.
Speaker C:Because she's using it as a distraction from.
Speaker C:From the fact that Bobby's dead and from thinking about it and from processing and from going through the funeral arrangements.
Speaker C:Because, like, it's also revealed earlier in the episode, that chimney pestered the federal government or whoever that chimney pestered them to giving.
Speaker C:Well, for them to release Bobby's remains, like, expediting it.
Speaker B:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker C:Because it's been two weeks.
Speaker B:How much longer would they have held on to it if, like, Athena didn't bother them and they were just like, no, I don't know.
Speaker C:And it almost feels like she wasn't going to do anything about it.
Speaker C:She was just waiting for them to call her?
Speaker B:Which, again, is like, that avoidance.
Speaker B:Just kind of like, it's out of my hands.
Speaker B:Yeah, yeah, But.
Speaker B:But we see her, like, as she's looking at her wall for this case, we see Bobby as a force ghost, basically, which.
Speaker B:Which I take as, like, you know, her kind of a visual projection of her thought process and her internal monologue, basically, as exemplified in, like, a Bobby form.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker A:Like, well, do you not ever hear your loved one in your head?
Speaker A:Like, you don't hear, like, you don't.
Speaker A:Not their actual voice, but, like, you don't ever do something that's maybe dumb or something they've witnessed you do, and you hear what they would say to you in that situation?
Speaker B:Oh, yeah, that's kind of what I.
Speaker A:No, you're saying her internal monologue, not like, what she was imagining he would say.
Speaker A:Sorry, that's not what I thought you were saying.
Speaker B:Oh, yes.
Speaker B:So that's.
Speaker B:That's how I interpret it.
Speaker B:Because, I mean, I.
Speaker B:I was seeing online some people saying, like, Bobby would never talk to Athena that way.
Speaker B:And I'm like.
Speaker B:I think that's more of, like, what Athena would say to herself, but she's using, like, the guise of Bobby to say it to herself, if that makes sense.
Speaker B:That's how I.
Speaker B:That's how I interpreted it.
Speaker B:It's very.
Speaker B:It's like, similar to what you're saying, Han.
Speaker A:But I don't agree that he wouldn't say those things to her.
Speaker B:Like, I don't disagree personally, but.
Speaker B:But that's.
Speaker B:That's just how I interpreted it.
Speaker A:Okay.
Speaker A:No, I understand.
Speaker C:Wait, that you agree that he would or he wouldn't say that?
Speaker A:No, I think he would say those things.
Speaker C:I.
Speaker C:I think he would, too.
Speaker A:I absolutely think he would.
Speaker A:He's always been very blunt.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker A:He's not beat around the bush.
Speaker A:And, you know, he knows that how she's had to deal with this before, and he knows what it feels like to deal with this.
Speaker A:Okay.
Speaker A:And, you know, so, you know, if he was actually a ghost, and watching her for two weeks just not deal with it.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker A:He would be like, you knew me.
Speaker A:Oh, so you're doing this thing instead of planning my funeral?
Speaker A:Like, yeah, it just sounds like him.
Speaker B:It's.
Speaker A:And like, the humor, like the, like, it's the gallows humor he had while he was alive.
Speaker A:But just now he's dead.
Speaker A:Like, I don't know, it just, that seemed very in character to me of, like, what he would actually say.
Speaker C:Like, I, I, I like both.
Speaker C:I like both.
Speaker C:That, that it could be his, that it's in character, and that it could be.
Speaker C:This is how Athena would speak to herself.
Speaker C:Or this is Athena thinking about Bobby of how he would say that to her.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:Exactly.
Speaker B:Yeah, that's, that's it.
Speaker B:That's it.
Speaker B:So it's like it's Bobby funneled through Athena's mind, I think is what I meant.
Speaker B:That makes sense.
Speaker C:Thank you.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker C:So Athena finally is able to.
Speaker C:So when, when Athena was finally able to reveal to the.
Speaker C:To Leah.
Speaker C:Her name was Leah.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:To Leah that, you know, it was not that the, that the DNA is matched.
Speaker C:Leah revealed.
Speaker C:At least this is how I interpreted.
Speaker C:Because, you know, Leah also knew Bobby, and so she says that.
Speaker C:I can see why he loved you.
Speaker C:You're a special person.
Speaker C:Yeah, Paraphrasing.
Speaker C:So Leah has that flashback about Bobby and about how he also lost two kids.
Speaker C:And so the way I interpret it is that she's referring back, or she's relaying this back to Athena.
Speaker C:And this is how Athena has the idea to bring Bobby to Minnesota, which.
Speaker C:Yeah, I guess feelings, I have mixed feelings about that because, you know, Because.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:So, like, he's being brought back to his first family, but what about his found family that won't be able to really visit him?
Speaker C:They'd have to, like, pay out a pot.
Speaker C:It's just annoying.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Like, I totally get where Athena was going with this.
Speaker B:I think the idea is beautiful.
Speaker B:And it's like a full circle thing.
Speaker B:And, you know, they had, they had Bobby in, in Leah's flashback, say, like, you know, I, I have hope and faith that I'll see them again soon.
Speaker B:But, like, I thought that was more of, like, in heaven spiritually.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:We're looking at each other's bones underground, like, allegedly.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:So it's just, it's like I didn't feel like Athena would have had, like, had to take that so literally.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:And I feel like that is kind of like, I get what, I get what she was doing, and I get what the writing is doing.
Speaker B:With that, I get it on both a character and, like, a writing standpoint.
Speaker B:I don't like it.
Speaker A:I don't.
Speaker A:I hate it.
Speaker A:I think it's disrespectful to what this entire show is.
Speaker A:And this show isn't about Bobby from Minnesota and his life in Minnesota.
Speaker A:This show is about Bobby who made a new life for himself after Minnesota with all of these other people.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Who are still alive, by the way.
Speaker A:There's no one alive in Minnesota to visit him.
Speaker B:No.
Speaker B:Not even in the ground.
Speaker B:Not even his mom and his brother, who they don't live, travel around the country.
Speaker B:And.
Speaker B:And it's just like, maybe this is getting into, like, the Bobby stuff.
Speaker A:Maybe it is, but I figured it wasn't even worth it to try and change the subject and get back into it later.
Speaker A:So.
Speaker B:Okay, let's just, like, transition this into, like, the Bobby section, I guess, because.
Speaker B:Yeah, like, the.
Speaker B:One of the last things Bobby says to Athena is, you know, I.
Speaker B:Like, LA was supposed to be my penance, but.
Speaker B:But he started a new life here.
Speaker B:He started a new family.
Speaker B:And I feel like it kind of putting him in Minnesota, allegedly putting him in Minnesota completely, like, negates the fact that.
Speaker B:That Bobby did actually live in LA once he gave himself the opportunity, once he and Athena had their new beginnings together and.
Speaker B:And grew that family and.
Speaker B:And his relationships there and.
Speaker B:And the family of the 118.
Speaker B:And it just seems so disappointing then that, like, nobody else has easy.
Speaker B:I was about to say, like, easy access to him, but, like, that's what it is.
Speaker A:You.
Speaker B:You wouldn't.
Speaker B:We wouldn't be able to see Buck visit Bobby's grave.
Speaker B:You know, like, how we've.
Speaker B:We've seen Eddie and Christopher visit Shannon's grave.
Speaker B:You know, I mean, she was living in LA anyways, but, like, now we can't see Buck talk to Bobby unless he hops on a plane or God forbid, Eddie, who.
Speaker A:We haven't seen any of his grief, who wasn't even there, who hasn't seen bobby since episode 10.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:And it just seems.
Speaker B:It just seems kind of strange to me that, like, you would put Bobby back in a place that is so full.
Speaker B:Like, there are some good memories, but the.
Speaker B:The majority of them are painful at this point.
Speaker A:Like, when it comes down to.
Speaker A:Makes no sense.
Speaker A:Just like, because of.
Speaker A:You can't tell me that all of these people don't have living wills and, like, where they want to be buried, that kind of thing planned out.
Speaker A:There's no way, like, my parents didn't like work in an industry where like, they had to think about that kind of stuff.
Speaker A:But like, their parents all like, died younger, so they did think about that stuff.
Speaker A:And they've had, they bought plots for themselves when they were like 30 years old.
Speaker A:Like, you can't tell me that people who put their lives on the line, who have had many near death experiences, didn't talk about this, have a living will, like anything.
Speaker A:That's crazy to me.
Speaker C:Second of all, are we getting a will episode?
Speaker A:I have no idea.
Speaker B:I doubt it.
Speaker C:Now it's gonna be off screen.
Speaker A:They would have read that before they buried him.
Speaker C:It's gonna be off screen.
Speaker A:My second point is that a grave is not for the dead, it's for the living.
Speaker A:So it literally makes sense.
Speaker A:No sense.
Speaker A:Once you're dead, you don't give a where you are your consciousness, whether you believe in like the afterlife or not.
Speaker A:Bobby did, but he knew that, like, he was not going to exist there.
Speaker A:So do you think that he would be happy with the fact that all of the people who love him that are still alive can't visit him?
Speaker A:I just, yeah, it's stupid.
Speaker C:I think it's just weird that.
Speaker C:I mean, not weird.
Speaker C:I get, I get why.
Speaker C:Why Athena did it.
Speaker C:I get it.
Speaker C:I just think it's weird that it has to come from this random woman's mouth and, and she got the idea from, from that.
Speaker C:And she was like, okay, Minnesota.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:And can I just say, and we can cut this out if it's a little too.
Speaker B:But like, you're gonna tell me a man who was actively, like suicidal for years.
Speaker A:Oh, yeah.
Speaker B:Did not have a plan in place.
Speaker B:Even if he didn't, which I assume he would, like, once he and Athena got together, I would assume he would change it sort of thing like, like his plan.
Speaker B:But you can't, you can't tell me that a man who was as actively suicidal as Bobby, who planned to like save 148 lives and then just like go away, did not have a plan in place, already set up.
Speaker A:It's not even the active.
Speaker A:I mean, that is a point.
Speaker A:It's not even that.
Speaker A:It's the fact that he knows what it's like to plan the funeral of your spouse.
Speaker A:So there's.
Speaker A:I just, I don't believe any fucking world that Bobby Martyr Nash is making other people plan his funeral.
Speaker A:I feel like it's done.
Speaker A:I feel like he planned it to a T.
Speaker A:Like he.
Speaker B:That, that is Mr.
Speaker B:I'm planning clipboard Buck.
Speaker A:Like, that's yeah.
Speaker B:Like, the way he started planning his and Athena's wedding in season two before they just, like, went to the courthouse.
Speaker B:Get out of here.
Speaker B:Like, yeah.
Speaker B:He would not want to put that on Athena also.
Speaker B:Just, like, why would he and Athena not have had that discussion?
Speaker B:I mean, I know they've had, like, some of communication issues in the past, but, like, that would be an important thing.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Especially when the.
Speaker B:The foundation of their relationship was about spirituality and.
Speaker B:And not having a Promised tomorrow.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker A:They got married because they were like, tomorrow isn't promised.
Speaker A:Okay.
Speaker A:So, like, they've had the conversation.
Speaker B:I would.
Speaker B:I would assume that that was, like, one of the first things they did after they got married.
Speaker B:Like, okay, what do you want?
Speaker B:Okay, what do you want?
Speaker B:Perfect.
Speaker B:Done.
Speaker B:We don't have to talk about this ever again.
Speaker B:Like, it just seems so strange to me.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:Like, anyway, so the rest of Bobby's stuff.
Speaker B:Sorry.
Speaker B:So were you about to say anything?
Speaker C:Nothing.
Speaker C:I was trying to go back.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:To Athena or Bobby.
Speaker C:Bobby.
Speaker B:Okay.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Unfortunately, there's not much to talk about.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:In his own death episodes.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker C:Just.
Speaker C:Hey, he sacrificed himself for his team.
Speaker C:And I could point out, like, how he did it, you know, we all know.
Speaker C:But he really did, like, save them individually during the contagion arc.
Speaker C:So, like, he had to kind of operate on hen to get her to start breathing again.
Speaker C:With Chimney, it was the giving him the vaccine or getting the vaccine or sacrificing the vaccine for him, whichever way you want to see that.
Speaker C:But Robbie was getting oxygen, and then with Buck and Athena, honestly, he was trying to.
Speaker A:He was trying to save everyone from having to, like, witness him dying, like, gruesomely.
Speaker A:Yeah, yeah, but.
Speaker B:And, like, I get that his sacrifice is, like, a full circle moment for him.
Speaker A:Like.
Speaker B:Yeah, okay, sure, I get that.
Speaker B:Narratively, I get that.
Speaker B:If you look at his arc from season one to, like, 8:15, he has come, like, he's grown so much.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker C:And he's come full circle.
Speaker C:It's just.
Speaker B:Yeah, it's kind of like he.
Speaker C:He accomplished what he came out to do, which was the whole.
Speaker C:You know, the whole 148 souls in the book.
Speaker C:The ultimate moment, or the.
Speaker C:The people that he saved would have ultimately had been his team.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Like.
Speaker B:Like, literally, he wasn't able to save his family in Minnesota, but he was able to save his family here.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:And I think that means so much more than 148 names.
Speaker B:And I think he saw that as kind of like, his absolution.
Speaker B:But then I feel like it's Such a regression to.
Speaker B:To do this kind of like, okay, I've saved.
Speaker B:I've saved my family.
Speaker B:I've redeemed myself.
Speaker B:I'm gonna go, like, yeet myself from this earthly plane now.
Speaker B:Which is kind of essentially what he.
Speaker B:Like, he didn't do it on purpose necessarily, but it's.
Speaker A:And it's full circle in the way that it's.
Speaker B:Well, he would have he.
Speaker A:When he was actively suicidal or even just passively in the way that it was like, well, if I die, I die.
Speaker A:You know what I mean?
Speaker A:Which was literally until the end of season seven.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:So we finally get him saying, if I could choose, I would stay with you always.
Speaker A:He doesn't want to leave.
Speaker A:He wants to stay.
Speaker A:But, okay, cool.
Speaker B:Where's the redemption in that?
Speaker B:To me, like, to me, that's just like.
Speaker A:Anyway.
Speaker A:Anyway.
Speaker C:No, no, we're.
Speaker C:We're going to.
Speaker C:We're getting into some kind of territory anyway.
Speaker C:Bobby Bones, is he six feet underground?
Speaker C:Well, this is how we're operating right now.
Speaker B:Yeah, I know.
Speaker B:I.
Speaker B:I can't.
Speaker B:I said I was going to, but the doubt is strong.
Speaker B:I'm just following the.
Speaker C:Not as deep as Eddie, so, I mean, he could also crawl his Bobby up Grape.
Speaker C:I'm sorry.
Speaker C:I don't know what that was.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:So I guess that was his.
Speaker B:That was his arc Sacrifice Dead funeral.
Speaker B:Wow.
Speaker A:With, like, no focus on him in these episodes.
Speaker A:So weird.
Speaker A:Even in the one that's his funeral.
Speaker B:Yeah, I'll get to that later.
Speaker B:Okay.
Speaker B:That's Bobby done.
Speaker A:So Buck, even less to say here, weirdly.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:I mean, he's.
Speaker B:He's being big brother Buck, like, teaching Ravi the let go lesson that he learned, you know, seven years ago.
Speaker B:I love seeing him imparting some wisdom onto.
Speaker B:Onto someone like Ravi, who is obviously, like.
Speaker B:Like we said earlier, like, look.
Speaker B:Trying to look up to someone.
Speaker B:Trying to look for.
Speaker B:For like a.
Speaker B:A guide.
Speaker B:And.
Speaker B:And Buck continues to be.
Speaker B:To be in that kind of.
Speaker B:I keep.
Speaker B:I keep calling it his, like, authoritative voice because, like, when he gets cut off from.
Speaker B:From everyone else in the lab and he's on the outside looking in, he's like the.
Speaker B:The 118 sound off and he's like, I can't get in touch with my team.
Speaker B:And I.
Speaker B:I.
Speaker B:I felt like him stepping up in that way was kind of cool.
Speaker B:Which are little crumbs for later on, I think, but, like, they're develop.
Speaker B:Starting to develop that.
Speaker C:And let's just keep it in development, though.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Again, he goes with Athena and he Goes with Athena, he calls Tommy, who.
Speaker B:But it helps save the day because that provides the distraction.
Speaker B:So, like, Buck is smart for doing that.
Speaker B:Again, smart characters.
Speaker B:And then he, he and Bobby have their bonding moment and goodbye.
Speaker B:Hate that so much.
Speaker B:I'm trying.
Speaker B:This is like, what character work do we really have here?
Speaker A:Listen, this might be a hot take.
Speaker A:This might be a hot take.
Speaker A:I understand what Bobby was trying to do with that goodbye.
Speaker B:Oh, yeah, it's terrible.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker A:And this, I'm like, literally, until Bobby's dying breath, he did not fully understand Buck.
Speaker A:And that bothers me because if he did, he wouldn't have said this.
Speaker A:Worded this way to him, because I think he was trying to say to Buck, don't, Don't close yourself off from everyone.
Speaker A:Like, they need you.
Speaker A:Because he, like, knew that he would self isolate in his grief.
Speaker A:Like, he would fall apart.
Speaker A:So I think that was his way of being like, you're all gonna need each other.
Speaker A:But he was like, he was like.
Speaker A:But if I word it in a way that it's like, in order as his captain or that, like, they need him.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:Because that's what he's observed, is that like does best when he feels needed.
Speaker A:But instead what Buck is taking away from that is I can't feel my own feelings or grief.
Speaker B:Pick up the pieces.
Speaker A:Because I have to.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker A:I have to be here for everyone else.
Speaker A:Especially because I wasn't in the lab with Bobby and I didn't have to go through all of this with them.
Speaker C:Also kind of like going back a little bit.
Speaker C:Like the way I, I, I watched when I was watching these episodes, and I was like thinking about Buck's arc during it or what he was doing.
Speaker C:He was like, super helpless.
Speaker C:Like, he can't, he couldn't do anything.
Speaker C:Worst nightmare to the, to the point that.
Speaker B:Oh, that was another theme.
Speaker C:Worst nightmares that he.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker C:Yes.
Speaker C:Oh, I thought you were gonna say helpless, because I was, I was thinking about being helpless is also a theme for these couple of episodes.
Speaker C:Yeah, but like, because, like, he can't.
Speaker C:He can't go and get his team.
Speaker C:He can't do that.
Speaker C:He's being babysat by Athena.
Speaker C:He can't.
Speaker C:He has to call Tommy, of all people, to get them out of there.
Speaker C:That was like the, the only thing that he was able to really do.
Speaker C:And then, and then now with Bobby's last, couple of last words to him, it's like, well, this is the only thing that I can do, which is shouldering everyone else's grief and picking up all the pieces.
Speaker A:And he prefaces that by saying, you're gonna be okay.
Speaker A:And it's like.
Speaker A:And Buck is taking from that.
Speaker A:I have to be okay.
Speaker B:Exactly.
Speaker A:Everyone needs me.
Speaker A:And I just.
Speaker A:I'm so.
Speaker A:I know that you're dead, Bobby, but what the fuck?
Speaker B:It's.
Speaker B:It's one of those classic, like, even if you're not.
Speaker A:You thought you were dying.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:It's one of those classic moments where Bobby is trying to impart, like, sound advice.
Speaker B:But the way he delivers it, especially to Buck, is just, like, slightly off center.
Speaker B:And we see that time and time again.
Speaker B:Like, the.
Speaker B:The meaning behind it is good.
Speaker B:Like, what he means, what Bobby means behind it is good.
Speaker B:But the way that it's taken by Buck and the way that.
Speaker B:That Bobby actually delivers it to Buck is just.
Speaker B:It's not what he was trying to do.
Speaker B:And I also think that in this moment where.
Speaker B:Where Buck is receiving the last orders from his captain, Bobby needed to be a dad.
Speaker A:He needs to be his dad.
Speaker B:A captain.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:And Bobby didn't really understand that.
Speaker B:So, like, hand, kind of what you said earlier, like, Bobby still kind of doesn't understand Buck in that way.
Speaker B:And I feel like for that to be their last interaction, potentially their last interaction is so, like, disheartening.
Speaker A:He should have.
Speaker A:He should have literally just told him how much he loved him.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Not just, I love his dad, not his captain.
Speaker A:I.
Speaker A:And I don't.
Speaker A:I know people, a lot of people, I think, accept the I love you kid is like the acknowledgment of the relationship, the parent, like, child relationship that they have.
Speaker B:And I don't think needed it.
Speaker A:Needed more and needed more because they've never discussed it.
Speaker A:And I just.
Speaker B:He calls him kid all the time, but, like, he does.
Speaker A:And if they just have never discussed it, and I just hate this because this is the only parent he has.
Speaker A:It is.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:I mean, Maddie kind of, but she's.
Speaker B:She's more of his sister.
Speaker B:Bobby is the only positive parental figure he has ever had.
Speaker B:And Bobby thought the best thing for Buck was to be his captain and.
Speaker A:Then tells him to leave.
Speaker C:Let's see.
Speaker C:And.
Speaker C:And I.
Speaker C:I also have an issue with that.
Speaker C:But then I'm also like, would he have left if it wasn't an order?
Speaker B:That's the thing.
Speaker B:I don't think so.
Speaker B:But also, since when does Buck, like, follow all of the orders he picks and chooses?
Speaker B:He does, but I think.
Speaker B:I think he left because Bobby said he wanted to spend time with Athena.
Speaker B:And I think that's the only reason.
Speaker C:And honestly.
Speaker C:And that's the thing.
Speaker C:Like, I really feel like he could have just that instead of saying, I.
Speaker A:Need time with my wife.
Speaker B:Like, it was.
Speaker B:It was very authoritative.
Speaker B:It was very.
Speaker B:Just like, I'm the captain.
Speaker B:Listen to me.
Speaker B:Instead of like, hey, son, I love you so much.
Speaker C:Oh, even.
Speaker C:Hey, kid, please.
Speaker B:Yeah, like.
Speaker A:Like, and I need you to leave.
Speaker A:I want some alone time with my wife is the last words that Bobby Nash ever says.
Speaker B:Feels a little colder.
Speaker B:But I think.
Speaker B:I think that was maybe like, a way to push Buck away, to, like, push him to.
Speaker B:To leave.
Speaker B:And.
Speaker A:Yeah, and it's up.
Speaker A:I'm sorry.
Speaker A:I hate it.
Speaker C:It is.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:And because it's like his last wishes and whatever Buck does follow that.
Speaker B:But, like, it's destroying him.
Speaker B:Well.
Speaker A:And so he's very used to getting dismissed by his.
Speaker A:By parents.
Speaker B:Why'd you have to say that?
Speaker A:Yeah, he's used to.
Speaker A:He's used to being told to leave.
Speaker A:I need you to leave.
Speaker B:Why'd you have to say that?
Speaker A:Why do you think I'm so angry about it.
Speaker B:I would really like to not cry for another episode.
Speaker B:If I put my fingers here, the tears are.
Speaker C:I can't even see what she's doing.
Speaker A:She has her sleeves, like, draped like, under cavity.
Speaker B:You can't catch me.
Speaker A:Oh, my God.
Speaker C:Anyway, I think this concludes Buck's arc.
Speaker B:I mean.
Speaker C:No, it doesn't.
Speaker C:Actually.
Speaker C:I think I forgot a bunch of other.
Speaker B:No, it's fine.
Speaker B:I mean, it's not much more, but, like, we do see him, like, utterly, completely destroyed in that hallway.
Speaker B:And then two weeks later, he is very obviously concealed.
Speaker B:Don't feel what he said.
Speaker C:He's so pretty crying.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:But like, two weeks later, we see him in a very different place from where we last see him in 15.
Speaker B:And it's like, oh, conceal.
Speaker C:Don't feel.
Speaker B:You are taking Bobby's advice to heart, but it's not serving you.
Speaker A:Yeah, it's.
Speaker A:Is it season four when the Buckley's visit for the first time.
Speaker B:Yep.
Speaker A:His parents are like, he seems.
Speaker B:Oh, yeah.
Speaker A:Because she calls them and is worried about Buck because he's what?
Speaker A:In therapy, we get another therapy mention and they're like, he seems fine.
Speaker A:And she's like, yeah, I think he's better at that than.
Speaker A:Than we think he is.
Speaker A:And they were like, at what?
Speaker A:And she said, being fine.
Speaker B:This is.
Speaker B:Yeah, like Maddie should know.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:So, I mean, I.
Speaker B:I think it is completely in character for him to kind of like, be holding.
Speaker B:Holding down the grief.
Speaker B:Fort for everyone else.
Speaker B:And we.
Speaker B:We see this when he goes to, like, collect Chimney.
Speaker B:He has his.
Speaker B:On his, like, little authoritative Buck voice.
Speaker B:And I think it's.
Speaker B:It's almost like an emulation of Bobby a little bit that, like, very, like, authoritative, like, you know, put down.
Speaker B:Put down the drink and let's go sort of thing.
Speaker B:And.
Speaker B:But also the advice that he gives to Chimney is really lovely.
Speaker B:It's like, I think you're just supposed to live like.
Speaker B:That's beautiful.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:However, I don't think we've seen him crash out yet, because we know.
Speaker B:We know with Buck, if.
Speaker B:If he tries to hold stuff in, he's like a little volcano and is gonna explode at some point.
Speaker C:Yep.
Speaker A:So.
Speaker B:But will it explode with the earthquake or after it?
Speaker B:I don't know.
Speaker B:My.
Speaker A:So two things.
Speaker A:One, we already talked about the main reason I think that he is doing what he's doing right now, which was because it was Bobby's last wish or order, however you want to look at it.
Speaker A:But I also think it's just complete avoidance of looking.
Speaker A:That last interaction, like, he probably keeps batting it away, because I can tell you if that was the last thing my parents said to me.
Speaker B:Be angry.
Speaker A:Oh, I wouldn't be angry.
Speaker A:No.
Speaker A:I would.
Speaker A:I would feel like worthless and unloved, and I would just be thinking about it over and over again.
Speaker A:He might be angry, but I think.
Speaker A:I think it's gonna make him feel really awful if he looks at it.
Speaker C:I was gonna talk about.
Speaker C:I wanted to kind of talk about, like, kind of big picture between 16 and.
Speaker C:What.
Speaker C:We could potentially get this up.
Speaker B:Oh, yeah.
Speaker A:In that section.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:As long as you.
Speaker A:I'm sorry I got in.
Speaker A:I'm.
Speaker A:I'm in Buck's head right now, so I'm just saying all the Buckhead things while we're in the book section, but I can.
Speaker A:I can stop.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:So I.
Speaker B:I wrote down, like, he's probably a ticking tide bomb weeping new.
Speaker C:A bomb, you say?
Speaker A:Then bomb.
Speaker C:And Buck, the foundations are gonna.
Speaker A:Likely place for a bomb to be.
Speaker B:So would you say that he's under pressure.
Speaker B:Wrong one.
Speaker B:It's always the wrong one.
Speaker B:Use.
Speaker B:They use the Billy Joel pressure one.
Speaker A:I don't actually.
Speaker A:I don't think there's anything really else about, like, the character arc.
Speaker A:Just like we see him at the procession.
Speaker A:He's the one that, like, puts the captain's hat on the truck.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:So Chimney does, like, hand.
Speaker A:Hand it to him.
Speaker B:Hand Buck the helmet, and he puts the.
Speaker B:Puts the helmet on the truck.
Speaker B:And there's this really lovely moment as he's kind of like caressing the.
Speaker B:The turnout suit.
Speaker B:And I guess you could kind of see, like, if they're starting to set up, like Buck being captain or whatever that is like, literally the literal, like, handing of like the reigns and stuff like that.
Speaker C:But I don't want it.
Speaker B:That's another.
Speaker B:That's another thing.
Speaker B:Absolutely not.
Speaker B:Yeah, I think we've said before, it's.
Speaker B:It's a little premature, but like that moment.
Speaker B:Lovely.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker C:Nice.
Speaker C:Sorry.
Speaker B:It's nice.
Speaker B:No, I know, I know.
Speaker B:I haven't even looked at it like that.
Speaker A:I just looked at it as like a reverence of like.
Speaker A:That's the last vestige he's ever going to have touching a piece of Bobby.
Speaker B:Yeah, that too.
Speaker B:Like, twofold.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker A:Cool, uplifting stuff.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:So here's our one minute of Eddie.
Speaker B:I'll read off all of the highlights that I.
Speaker B:That I put down.
Speaker B:Okay, get ready, get ready.
Speaker A:Let me get out a pen and notepad.
Speaker B:Eddie's character highlights off screen.
Speaker B:Grief, beard, single man tear, crumpet.
Speaker A:Hey, what the.
Speaker A:Are we doing okay?
Speaker A:What the.
Speaker A:Are we doing okay?
Speaker B:We can move on.
Speaker B:No, I'm kidding.
Speaker B:Like, but like, that was so quick.
Speaker B:That's it.
Speaker B:I'm sorry, I might have.
Speaker B:I might have switched the order of crumpet and single man tier.
Speaker B:My apologies.
Speaker B:It's been three.
Speaker A:It's been three weeks.
Speaker A:He didn't show up for three weeks.
Speaker C:He's poor, he's surviving on Uber money and paying rent.
Speaker C:He can Uber in la, paying whatever.
Speaker B:Want to leave Christopher with his parents for that long?
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker A:Could have taken Christopher.
Speaker A:Christopher.
Speaker B:I know, I have thoughts on that.
Speaker A:That sounds fake to me, but whatever.
Speaker A:Sure.
Speaker A:We'll call that in character.
Speaker A:And then we have off screen buddy reunion hug.
Speaker A:So canonically, since that happened off screen, there was also some.
Speaker A:Some, like there was some tension there.
Speaker A:I don't know what else.
Speaker A:Just off screen, he came, he ate with looks and food.
Speaker C:He served.
Speaker A:He served looks again while crying.
Speaker B:And he was there.
Speaker C:It was phenomenal.
Speaker A:I guess he was there.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:I mean, three quarters of the way.
Speaker B:Into the episode, the most interaction he had with a character wasn't even Buck.
Speaker B:It was Robbie, which I thoughts about that.
Speaker B:Tell us your thoughts.
Speaker C:We all know that was to diffuse any type of tension.
Speaker C:And I'm a little concerned with what we might be getting later.
Speaker C:But yeah, that's what that was.
Speaker C:Because the last thing we got with Eddie was the whole, well, are we transitioning into buddy?
Speaker C:Because, like, I mean, at this point.
Speaker A:What else is there to say about Eddie by himself still?
Speaker B:I told you it was one minute.
Speaker C:Well, we all know how he feels.
Speaker C:Just with one line.
Speaker A:Oh, well, he's.
Speaker C:Yes, Just one line.
Speaker A:I should have been there.
Speaker C:I should have been there.
Speaker A:Yeah, you should have.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker C:But, hey, he's here now.
Speaker B:Says Buck.
Speaker C:Anyway.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker C:And then they.
Speaker C:They have their little whatever thing they.
Speaker B:Do with their eyes and, like, Buck's little, like, smile.
Speaker C:Oh, yeah.
Speaker C:When he's.
Speaker C:He's like, oh, my God, I got a surprise for everyone.
Speaker B:Look who's here.
Speaker C:And here's the Disney Channel crossover star.
Speaker B:And reveal.
Speaker C:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker C:Or like, those epic MCU cameos from, like, very, you know.
Speaker B:Yeah, it's.
Speaker B:It's a very, like, classic TV kind of, like, character reveal.
Speaker B:Someone you haven't seen in a long time where it's like the person is standing in front of them and, like, steps away and it's like, oh, my God, it's that person.
Speaker C:Wow.
Speaker B:And I'm just like, you shouldn't.
Speaker C:Time in place.
Speaker B:It's the only time we see Buck smile in the entire episode.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker C:And I guess that speaks volumes.
Speaker C:I don't know.
Speaker B:It does.
Speaker B:It does.
Speaker B:But in March, it's such a small moment.
Speaker B:And it's like, at least they're in the same shot on screen.
Speaker C:At least they're sitting next to each other at the funeral.
Speaker B:Yep.
Speaker A:I crave death.
Speaker B:We have really reached the dusty elephant.
Speaker C:We are.
Speaker A:We're like, oh, my God.
Speaker A:Not only was Cass in the episode, but him and Dean had screamed together.
Speaker A:Bumped shoulders.
Speaker B:Like Eddie did.
Speaker B:Bump shoulders.
Speaker B:Oh, my God.
Speaker A:Hate it here.
Speaker A:This is so.
Speaker A:Such weird behavior.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Him.
Speaker C:Step away from the supernatural.
Speaker C:I'm telling you.
Speaker B:That is not.
Speaker A:It's an anti guide.
Speaker A:It's the what not to do guide.
Speaker A:Anyway, I don't know.
Speaker A:Is there anything else to say here?
Speaker C:Oh, I.
Speaker C:I guess we already talked about the Buddy of it all.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:I was gonna say, like, this is basically Eddie and buddy, but I was going to say something about how, like, Eddie, you know, had more interaction with Robbie and still.
Speaker B:I think.
Speaker B:I think you are correct.
Speaker B:Like, it was.
Speaker B:It was to kind of, like, distract from.
Speaker B:From having too much Buck and Eddie, because if they had anything, they would have to address something.
Speaker B:And obviously this is not.
Speaker B:I understand.
Speaker B:This is not like, the time or place for that.
Speaker B:Like, that's fine with me.
Speaker B:You just have to get it later on.
Speaker B:But I also thought it was sweet that, like, Ravi was looking, was, you know, looking to Eddie For.
Speaker B:For some more advice.
Speaker B:And I think that's all that.
Speaker B:That happened for Eddie.
Speaker A:It couldn't have given me a shot of the couch with like some blankets and a pillow on there or something?
Speaker A:Like, give me something.
Speaker B:Is he sleeping in Christopher's old room?
Speaker A:I don't know.
Speaker B:And like that little itty bitty twin sized bed.
Speaker A:It can be whatever we want because it all's happening off screen.
Speaker B:So great.
Speaker B:They share bed.
Speaker B:It's canon now.
Speaker B:Like, they're.
Speaker B:They're in Bucksburg.
Speaker A:Eddie refuses to sleep on the placenta couch as he should on the amniotic fluid couch.
Speaker B:Yeah, it's uncomfortable.
Speaker B:The last person who slept on that.
Speaker A:He'S like, I don't care how much money you spent to get the thing cleaned.
Speaker A:I've seen.
Speaker A:I've seen a baby be born.
Speaker B:No, not even that he was there.
Speaker B:He just knows.
Speaker B:I guess the only other thing is like he was eating a crumpet, I guess.
Speaker B:And so that's obviously Buck who baked it.
Speaker B:So Buck is one like, like stressed baking and made with love and one.
Speaker C:That enjoys his baking.
Speaker C:Yeah, truly.
Speaker B:But.
Speaker B:But also the fact that I guess we can kind of see this continuation of.
Speaker B:Of Eddie allowing himself to indulge in these sweet treats.
Speaker B:So, like, that's consistent.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker C:They said, well, we don't have juice right now, so here's.
Speaker B:Oh, but there, there.
Speaker B:There was a lot of juice in 16 in the episode because we got juice Buck pouring juice over at Maddie's house.
Speaker B:We got May and Harry bring juice over to Athena.
Speaker B:So like joy and family and was.
Speaker C:There juice at Henry?
Speaker B:They were having breakfast.
Speaker B:I don't remember.
Speaker B:But like, there was a lot of juice.
Speaker B:Juice theory is still alive and well, alive and kicking.
Speaker B:Unlike some other things.
Speaker B:Maybe.
Speaker B:Did you say, like this show?
Speaker A:I said, like, my faith in this show.
Speaker B:Very questionable.
Speaker B:Yep.
Speaker A:So also, future Rachel, feel free to cut out all of the negative things if Bobby's actually alive.
Speaker B:No, I'm leaving it.
Speaker A:No, cut it out.
Speaker A:No.
Speaker A:Why Comments like that.
Speaker A:Don't need to stay if he's alive.
Speaker B:Oh, these kind of got it.
Speaker B:Okay.
Speaker B:Like, got it.
Speaker B:I was like, the stuff that we talked about that should stay.
Speaker A:No, no, no, no, that's fine.
Speaker A:I don't need to be like, faith in the show.
Speaker B:Yeah, well, we still wouldn't.
Speaker B:By the time this comes out, we still won't have seen 18.
Speaker A:The loss of faith is tentative.
Speaker A:Like, it's all very in limbo right now.
Speaker A:It is.
Speaker B:You see how they're.
Speaker A:I need to see how they're landing everything too.
Speaker A:Would you.
Speaker B:Would you say it's in Purgatory or the Empty?
Speaker C:Not the empty.
Speaker C:There's no way.
Speaker B:Rather, I think it's.
Speaker A:I think it's in purgatory.
Speaker C:I think it's in Purgatory.
Speaker C:There might be a way out.
Speaker A:There might be a way out, but it's gonna be complicated to get there.
Speaker A:And there's a lot of things in there that could more likely go wrong.
Speaker C:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker C:They might just leave Bobby for dead, but we get Buddy Cannon.
Speaker B:That's not a win scenario for me.
Speaker B:I can't think about Buddy Cannon.
Speaker C:I can.
Speaker A:I can.
Speaker A:But I can.
Speaker C:But, like, I've had to because.
Speaker A:Oh, yeah.
Speaker C:Because of the.
Speaker C:The me closing on Buddy Alive maxing.
Speaker C:I'm like, okay, let's just shift focus.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker C:What did I say?
Speaker A:You said Buddy Alive, Max.
Speaker B:Well, they might have an nde, but who knows if that's an N.
Speaker B:Oh, my God, Rachel, stop.
Speaker A:You keep that to yourself.
Speaker B:For real.
Speaker C:We don't need another one.
Speaker C:Anyway, sorry, I've had to switch from Bobby Alive Maxing to Buddy Alive Buddy to Buddy Maxing.
Speaker C:Buddy Cannon maxing.
Speaker C:Whatever.
Speaker C:We're calling it Buddy Maxing because I've.
Speaker C:I've closed maybe like about 90% closed on Bobby Alive.
Speaker C:Or at least that's how I'm going to operate going forward until they surprise me at 8:58pm on 5 15.
Speaker A:And if they surprise me, that's great.
Speaker A:And then I'll be in a place where I can enjoy that instead of Bobby Alive maxing when I don't really believe in it as much anymore and then getting disappointed again and again because mental health.
Speaker A:I can't.
Speaker A:I cannot.
Speaker B:I will live with it somehow if it's not.
Speaker B:But I'm still like, I.
Speaker B:I don't.
Speaker C:Know that I get there's evidence.
Speaker C:Yeah, no, yeah, I get it.
Speaker C:It's the hope.
Speaker A:I get that there's plenty of evidence.
Speaker A:We'll talk about that in a minute.
Speaker A:We have some new, hopefully temporary sections called what Worked for Us and what Didn't Work for Us.
Speaker A:Because normally things just work for us.
Speaker A:Like, even if it's a storyline we don't like, we think it's like, well written, that kind of thing.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:But this again, tentatively, until we see how it lands.
Speaker A:There are things.
Speaker A:But anyway, we'll start out with the positive.
Speaker A:What worked?
Speaker B:Positive.
Speaker A:Spoiler alert.
Speaker A:It's a short list.
Speaker B:I was trying to come up with.
Speaker A:More things and I was like, there just aren't.
Speaker B:There just aren't it's little things.
Speaker A:The number one thing that worked for us was Eddie being on our screen.
Speaker A:Do that more every episode.
Speaker A:Much, much more.
Speaker A:Like he's a main character.
Speaker A:Maybe just an idea.
Speaker B:He is.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:The acting like this was like said.
Speaker B:If the, if the Emmys cared about network television, this would absolutely like 8, 6 teen specifically maybe 8 for like Peter Krausa as well.
Speaker B:But like Angela Bassett.
Speaker B:Peter Krausa, Kenny Choi.
Speaker B:This would be like for your consideration level episodes acting for their acting.
Speaker B:Like.
Speaker A:Yeah, it's.
Speaker B:It's Angela Bassett and kccu, the Kenneth Choice Cinematic Universe.
Speaker C:Oh my God.
Speaker C:With Angela though, I, I need her.
Speaker C:I, I really hope that it would be for your consideration for an Emmy because like she channeled, you know, the last time I saw this level of acting from her was.
Speaker C:I mean she's always great, don't get me wrong.
Speaker C:But like this kind of level of like this visceral, you know, like this grief.
Speaker C:Like that kind of grief.
Speaker C:The last time I saw that was with Wakanda Forever.
Speaker C:Yes.
Speaker C:And I like immediately nominated for that.
Speaker C:She got nominated for that and didn't get the Oscar.
Speaker C:And I think there is commentary in the beginning of season one about that actually, and I think it's funny.
Speaker C:But see, so not season one.
Speaker C:I'm sorry, Season seven.
Speaker C:Beginning of season seven.
Speaker C:And, and yeah, like she.
Speaker C:I really hope that they do consider this for, for her to get an Emmy nom.
Speaker C:And maybe even win.
Speaker C:Because she deserves it.
Speaker C:She really deserves it.
Speaker A:She does.
Speaker A:But on the same side, I don't want Tim to think that this was good.
Speaker A:So.
Speaker B:Only parts that made it good.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Was Angela Bassett.
Speaker B:I know because she's Angela Bassett.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Like she can take.
Speaker A:She can.
Speaker B:She could read a telephone book and make it like an Oscar worthy performance.
Speaker A:True.
Speaker B:So she can do anything with.
Speaker B:No matter what kind of.
Speaker B:Or what kind of material she's been given.
Speaker B:But like the, the way that she was able to like portray the, the nuance between her projecting of.
Speaker B:Of Athena's case into how she's actually feeling and like letting that out with, with all of the, the pain and the anger and the sorrow was like that I think was the only cathartic experience I had while watching these three episodes.
Speaker A:First scene with Hen where she like had a, her little breakdown.
Speaker A:That was.
Speaker B:Yes, that's what I'm talking about.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:That was the moment for me of that episode.
Speaker B:Huh.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:And.
Speaker B:And Kenny was just phenomenal.
Speaker B:Anytime he cries, like I'm crying.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:He just, he just pulls from like something so Deep in himself.
Speaker B:And it's.
Speaker B:I think Oliver posted on his Insta.
Speaker B:Instagram story is like a master class in acting.
Speaker B:And like, I can't really say anything more praiseworthy than.
Speaker B:Than that.
Speaker B:Like, that is.
Speaker B:That is both of them, like, bravo.
Speaker B:And then I.
Speaker B:I put this point.
Speaker B:I liked parts of the funeral.
Speaker B:Like, I liked the scale of the.
Speaker B:This is a weirdly specific.
Speaker A:Oh, like the pomp and circumstance.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Like, I liked the scale.
Speaker B:I liked how big they made it because they were in like this giant church.
Speaker B:You saw all of these extras.
Speaker B:There were so many flowers and pictures and then the whole processional was so big.
Speaker C:All of that for a three minute montage.
Speaker B:I'm.
Speaker A:I gotta be so for real with you, though.
Speaker A:They could have filmed that on a closed set and had to have the same effect.
Speaker A:What.
Speaker A:What was I looking at around that would have made a difference?
Speaker B:Nothing.
Speaker C:Maybe they needed more space.
Speaker B:Maybe they.
Speaker A:I don't know.
Speaker A:They have city street sets.
Speaker A:Yeah, it's my thing.
Speaker A:So I don't know.
Speaker B:I don't know.
Speaker B:So anyways, I just.
Speaker B:Could they have probably replicated some of the scale on.
Speaker B:On a set?
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker B:But I did.
Speaker B:I did like the scale.
Speaker B:I liked how big it looked.
Speaker C:I agree.
Speaker B:That was that for.
Speaker B:That for the funeral.
Speaker B:And then I think we've already spoken about it, but Bobby's goodbye speech to Athena, again, not the fact that it was happening, but the speech itself about him, you know, like not.
Speaker B:Not choosing to leave her and.
Speaker B:And how, you know, his.
Speaker B:He started a new life.
Speaker B:When he asked her out to dinner and she said yes, I thought that was lovely.
Speaker B:And then I al.
Speaker B:I also liked the Bucks 118 sound off.
Speaker B:I mentioned that earlier as well.
Speaker B:I just.
Speaker B:I don't know.
Speaker B:I.
Speaker B:Something about that, like, tickles my brain when that.
Speaker B:That very specific moment.
Speaker C:Yeah, that's what he does with his voice.
Speaker C:It's.
Speaker C:It's very.
Speaker A:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker C:I don't.
Speaker C:I don't know what.
Speaker C:How to describe it, but it's.
Speaker C:It tick.
Speaker C:Yeah, it does tickle your brain.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Like, it's one of those buck cadences that.
Speaker B:That just like, gets stuck in our head so often.
Speaker B:But also like, you know, when he.
Speaker B:When he reaches like, pitches that only dogs can hear when.
Speaker B:When it's like, you know, he pulls his voice like from the.
Speaker B:The deepest parts of his diaphragm, you know?
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:I loved getting more Ravi.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker A:I.
Speaker A:I love that we just got like an illusion that he has people in his life.
Speaker A:Never had that before.
Speaker A:He was talking about like, I don't know if like I should call them.
Speaker A:We don't know who them are, but like they exist.
Speaker A:I liked, I liked having a Robbie Focus storyline.
Speaker A:I really loved that.
Speaker A:I love the, the building, Buck and Ravi, friendship and partnership.
Speaker A:But like I love seeing them build a friendship like outside of work.
Speaker C:Yeah, that's it.
Speaker A:That's, that's like it for me.
Speaker A:I think I did, I did really like the beginning of 14 before we started the contagion storyline.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:And I think I probably would have liked 14 if the contagion storyline was contained in one episode.
Speaker C:Yeah, this could have just been one episode.
Speaker B:So I think that's what worked for us, generally speaking.
Speaker C:Okay, so what didn't work for us?
Speaker B:The realism.
Speaker C:The realism.
Speaker C:And what the fuck is that?
Speaker B:So for anyone, for anyone who doesn't know, which I don't know how you're listening to us and not know at this point, but you know, after 15, Tim did a couple interviews and you know, was asked about the reason for why they decided to kill Bobby off allegedly.
Speaker B:And, and Tim was basically saying, you know, it's realistic to up the stakes and, and that not everybody can always survive all the time.
Speaker B:Like it's realistic.
Speaker B:And to that I say no.
Speaker A:I googled before we started what the like death rate is for firefighters in the United States and it said like, was it 200?
Speaker B:Was 100?
Speaker A:100, like around 100 a year.
Speaker B:That's average, on average.
Speaker B:And how many firefighters are there in the U.S.
Speaker B:oh wait, no, you, because you said it was like 1 to 2%.
Speaker B:So.
Speaker A:Yeah, yeah, so.
Speaker A:So the, the average death rate of U.S.
Speaker A:firefighters is 1 to 2% per year.
Speaker A:Per year.
Speaker A:So like very.
Speaker A:So actually the fact that you killed him is not super realistic, I think.
Speaker B:Yeah, I think it was actually more realistic for them to obtain injuries on the job and then get better or you know, if you want to go for realism, like obtain injury on job and then have to not be actually recover.
Speaker A:Yeah, here's my thing.
Speaker A:If we're gonna start talking about we want things to be realistic, we're gonna have to make some big changes because we've been, we've been hand waving logic for a long time on certain things and just like that was fine.
Speaker A:That was the established rules of the universe.
Speaker A:But if, like we're going to be like, well now logic has to be here to make things have mistakes.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:If you're, if you're citing realism as one of the reasons for a creative decision, something like this, you can't really pick and choose the real, like, what is being considered realistic and what is not because that inherently breaks the logic of the show.
Speaker B:So either everything has to be realistic and you have to be like, the mo.
Speaker B:You have to be like the Pit and being the most, like, medically accurate.
Speaker A:Just watch it over the weekend.
Speaker B:Oh, nice.
Speaker B:I still want to.
Speaker B:I still want to watch that.
Speaker B:So you either be like the Pit and be like, the most medically accurate show, like, people have ever seen.
Speaker B:They will.
Speaker A:They would never.
Speaker B:Or just, like, throw realism out the window because it is a show.
Speaker A:But, like.
Speaker A:But.
Speaker A:But just on principle, if you're going to kill someone because of realism, kill them in a realistic way.
Speaker A:And dying because you got exposed to an aerosolized virus that is not airborne is not realistic.
Speaker B:Yeah, so.
Speaker B:So it's being realistic about the fact that characters die, but not being realistic about the way in which he died is kind of a logical fallacy to me.
Speaker A:And the way they talked about it made it sound like it was, like, one of the deadliest diseases and, like, it was guaranteed that you would die from it.
Speaker B:No.
Speaker B:They even sent in studies, like, 30%.
Speaker A:Did they?
Speaker A:Because Moira was, like, not talking like that.
Speaker B:Well, I think this.
Speaker B:I think the army people were talking about the regular strain.
Speaker B:So I think the strain that she made probably made it more deadly.
Speaker B:But, like.
Speaker A:All right, whatever.
Speaker B:But again, realism.
Speaker B:She created a super strain and an antiviral before lunch.
Speaker A:Sure.
Speaker A:Then we used a needle this big on a rat this big, and it was fine.
Speaker A:I'm sorry.
Speaker B:Whatever.
Speaker A:No, I can't.
Speaker A:If you want to kill a character because of realism, everything in that episode needs to be the most realistic shit you've ever done in your life.
Speaker A:I'm sorry.
Speaker B:I guess I take it more as, like, a conceptual realism, as, like.
Speaker B:But anyways, can we move on?
Speaker A:Yep.
Speaker B:I hate realism.
Speaker B:So what didn't work for me was, like, how Fractured the 118 was, specifically in episode 16.
Speaker B:I get it.
Speaker B:And I get why they were all, like, separated in 14 and 15.
Speaker B:I think that was a fine, like, thought device decision sort of thing, because I get what you were doing with that.
Speaker B:I didn't like how it was continued.
Speaker B:I'm not saying I liked it.
Speaker B:I'm just saying I get it.
Speaker A:Okay.
Speaker B:Like, I.
Speaker B:I get that some people had to be, like, outside of the lab, like, Buck and everything like that.
Speaker A:I understand the logistics of that, but I'm saying I don't think it's a good choice for a major character death.
Speaker A:No, I think it's terrible.
Speaker B:No, I'm.
Speaker B:I'm saying I get it for the way, like, the.
Speaker B:The contagion, like.
Speaker A:Oh, well, yeah.
Speaker B:Being like, the concept of being trapped in a lab.
Speaker B:Well, yeah, I get that, like, you have to have them split up, but then you're.
Speaker B:You should have them all come together.
Speaker B:So I didn't like how that fracturedness was, like, kind of carried through into 16, because we don't really.
Speaker B:And it's.
Speaker B:And it's kind of because we don't see some of these two weeks in that time jump, but we don't see them, like, coming together.
Speaker B:It also doesn't seem like there was any either because Buck said, like, Chimney's not really talking to him.
Speaker B:Like, there's no coming together of the family.
Speaker C:It also sounds like Hen was just at home.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Like, recuperating.
Speaker B:So maybe there was a little bit of, like, maybe they all couldn't.
Speaker B:But why wouldn't they all, like, go over to Hen's house and, like, you know, sit bedside with her or the hospital or wherever she was.
Speaker A:So it's like photo Athena.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:And like, the.
Speaker B:The fracturedness between Athena and Buck not having any interaction, even though, like, they were attached at the hip in the.
Speaker B:In the last episode with 15.
Speaker B:And.
Speaker B:And.
Speaker C:And there's also, like, there's.
Speaker C:I think there's misdirected anger towards Chimney from Athena.
Speaker C:So maybe.
Speaker C:Maybe she didn't want anyone near her, including Chimney, which is why.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Which is why it's so important.
Speaker B:So, like, I get it, but I also don't like it.
Speaker B:And again, I haven't seen the rest of these two episodes, so I can't really speak to the way that the other characters are experiencing their grief.
Speaker B:But it's just like.
Speaker B:It just seems weird that, like, they haven't.
Speaker B:They usually, like, all band together and it seems weird.
Speaker A:This is also.
Speaker A:This is also.
Speaker A:I'm sorry, two sentences on the realism.
Speaker B:Okay.
Speaker A:Because it ties into what you're saying.
Speaker A:Because they wouldn't have been cleared.
Speaker A:Let's ignore the injuries, which they definitely still wouldn't have been over for Hen and Chimney, but they wouldn't have been cleared mentally to come back to work.
Speaker A:They would have had to go to grief counseling before they got cleared to come back to work.
Speaker A:And since none of them are clearly coping, I don't think they would have been cleared to come back to work.
Speaker A:And if they had been and they were coping, then they would have been talking to each other.
Speaker A:It just like.
Speaker A:It doesn't make sense.
Speaker B:Yeah, it's it's a purposeful like.
Speaker B:And that to me means that there was a purposeful separation of them.
Speaker B:And I'm just like, I'm still left wondering why maybe that'll be addressed more in the last two episodes.
Speaker B:But at this point I'm like, why are we so split up?
Speaker C:I can also just say that the split up is a season, is.
Speaker C:Is a two season long thing.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Well, it's the way less of a focus of the found family, which yeah.
Speaker A:Has been more of a problem since we've started season seven especially.
Speaker C:You would think this is how you'd fix it, Right?
Speaker A:You would think this is how you would fix it.
Speaker A:But also you think you would focus on that for the episode where you're killing the main character that is the center of them.
Speaker A:And your show is about fan found family.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:You guys know that you told us that in the second episode of the entire show and then you were consistent with it.
Speaker A:So what are we doing kind of to.
Speaker B:To that point?
Speaker B:Like in 16 there weren't any like no one from the 118.
Speaker B:No.
Speaker B:No one from the Grant family like spoke at the funeral.
Speaker B:Like it was only the chief.
Speaker B:And it just seems kind of like this would be a perfect opportunity for.
Speaker B:For like a larger funeral scene to have some of the 118.
Speaker B:Or, or you know, may Harry like speak and share memories about Bobby that like maybe we haven't been privy to because it wasn't in an episode or, or maybe it wasn't an episode.
Speaker B:And here's a different perspective of that.
Speaker B:Like the 709 montage from Ashes Ashes felt more impactful to Bobby's memory than.
Speaker B:Because we got to.
Speaker B:We got to see this montage and, and these interactions between these characters and.
Speaker B:And we didn't get to like share any, any memories of Bobby, which is.
Speaker C:Why the people who are still Bobby alive.
Speaker C:Maxing.
Speaker C:I mean it's valid because this is a really.
Speaker C:It's.
Speaker C:It's not.
Speaker C:It.
Speaker C:They did not bring that funeral home.
Speaker C:It was, it was not great.
Speaker C:It was like three minutes when we should really be either talking about Bobby, honoring bobby, having the 118 together, reminiscing.
Speaker C:And we didn't get that.
Speaker C:I don't know if this is something that they're planning on doing maybe at the last episode of the season.
Speaker C:They could.
Speaker C:Because they could try to mend like this fracturedness that we're seeing right now.
Speaker C:But I don't know.
Speaker B:We don't have all the contacts yet.
Speaker C:Nope.
Speaker B:Moving on one other Thing how they were breaking visual media rule.
Speaker B:Breaking visual media rule number three.
Speaker B:I just put number three.
Speaker B:I couldn't think of another number where.
Speaker B:And, and I'll say this because I'm the only one still not closing where in visual media media you're always supposed to show a body and they didn't at all between 15 or 16.
Speaker B:Like you don't even have to show us, but you can have like show.
Speaker A:One of the characters.
Speaker B:One of the characters seeing it.
Speaker B:So like Athena kind of like.
Speaker B:Or someone like identifying Bobby's body when they go to pick it up.
Speaker A:Someone identify the body, by the way, before you bury someone.
Speaker A:That's just like a legal thing.
Speaker B:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker B:So it's like, it's literally one of the biggest in text reasons why there is still so much doubt.
Speaker B:Like not even getting into the leaks, like the script leaks or anything like that.
Speaker B:But like you're breaking one of the, the most simple visual media rules.
Speaker B:And, and so like, and I know that knows this.
Speaker A:Tim, you have been doing.
Speaker B:You've been writing TV for like whatever.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker B:You know, the 90s.
Speaker A:You know this.
Speaker A:We all.
Speaker C:Yeah, well he does know this because he's like, the body bag didn't convince you.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:And it's just like that's where we're.
Speaker A:Mad at Tim voice.
Speaker A:The body bag didn't convince you.
Speaker A:Like he is a valley girl.
Speaker A:We're angry with it.
Speaker B:No, I love that actually.
Speaker B:I'm gonna.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Head came in that, you know, flipping his non existent hair.
Speaker B:So it's like that's just specifically looking at how the episode aired and the episode is red.
Speaker B:That is weird.
Speaker B:I don't, I don't get it.
Speaker B:Like, because that, that just puts so much doubt.
Speaker A:And like also, what also doesn't work, just piggybacking off of that is all of the fake outs and all of the textual stuff that you guys put on this show on purpose to foreshadow things, to parallel things, to.
Speaker A:To plant little seeds for us to find.
Speaker A:And the ga, because they're never super subtle.
Speaker A:I don't say that like meanly.
Speaker B:No.
Speaker B:Like I.
Speaker A:That's one of our favorite things we do.
Speaker B:We love picking up on that.
Speaker A:You've been doing that not just all season, but you've been doing it in this, this three episode arc specifically to show that he's alive.
Speaker A:Like we've gotten buried alive.
Speaker A:We've gotten Bobby almost dying and then surviving in 14.
Speaker A:Because in 14, like there's just so much.
Speaker A:I'm not going to go over it.
Speaker A:Because we went over a lot of this already in like three different places.
Speaker A:And you guys have probably seen all of it.
Speaker B:If you haven't heard our five stages of Bobby Grief special.
Speaker B:Go.
Speaker B:Listen.
Speaker A:There's just so much textually in there to, to point the viewer towards thinking that there's going to be a resurrection arc, that there's a fake out, that there's going to be some sort of miraculous recovery and then operating under the assumption of the story that they are telling us right now.
Speaker A:Yeah, they were like, well we just showed you all of that to be like, actually no, we're smarter.
Speaker A:What?
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:And specifically, specifically in this case, the, the false hope that is kind of spurred on from Athena's case that she takes with.
Speaker B:With Leah and you know, thinking that she saw her son who, who passed away, you know, however many years ago.
Speaker B:And it's like that whole thing.
Speaker B:I know some people are like, it's kind of a slap in the face to people who are thinking Bobby's alive.
Speaker B:Like this was written before, before the, the script leaks.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:So like it.
Speaker B:It's not a slap in the face against the fans who are thinking the.
Speaker A:Story that they're telling and that people would naturally believe that it's anticipated contingency.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker C:No, it really is a slap in the face is saying that they.
Speaker C:That he took this idea from like the Hotshots episode and the talking the fan off the ledge.
Speaker C:That's a sniff.
Speaker A:He was like, I.
Speaker A:That was like me pointing to like thinking of I was going in that direction.
Speaker B:And I'm like you're counter.
Speaker A:You're.
Speaker A:You're arguing against yourself in the own meta analysis that you put in your show.
Speaker B:Because in the Hot Shots, Brad, Brad brings his character back.
Speaker B:So.
Speaker B:But that's not specifically to talk a.
Speaker A:Guy off the ledge.
Speaker B:Like, like that's not part of these episodes.
Speaker B:We did talk about that in our.
Speaker B:In our Grief special.
Speaker A:But about these episodes about specifically this case that Athena did that they stole from a real story that took place in Philadelphia in 97.
Speaker A:And do you want to know something super hilarious, Alice?
Speaker A:In that true story, the kid actually was kidnapped and alive.
Speaker A:Now they weren't.
Speaker A:They weren't buried like exhumed the body.
Speaker A:It was the mom with the kid that she thought died in a fire like as an infant.
Speaker A:She was at a birthday party six years later.
Speaker B:Oh, similar.
Speaker A:And she thought was like.
Speaker A:I like thought.
Speaker A:Thought it was her kid.
Speaker A:Like it just, just the looks, the spirit, like she just had a feeling and she like pretended that something was in the girl's hair and took a couple strands of it and did a DNA test, which is, like, ethically.
Speaker A:Like, she begged.
Speaker A:No, but she went to the police and, like, begged them to do it.
Speaker A:Like, she did go through the authority channels.
Speaker A:And I mean, like, taking a couple strands of a kid's hair is kind of weird.
Speaker B:But, like, when you feel so strongly about that, like, I get it.
Speaker B:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker B:But that's crazy.
Speaker B:So, like, in.
Speaker B:In real life, the story that they pulled from real life is actually has the ending that it's really seemed like they were going to do in this episode.
Speaker B:And they did that fake out thing again, which really threw me off when we were watching.
Speaker B:And I was like, but literally everything that you set up here is leading me to believe that, like, it is going to be her son.
Speaker B:And then it wasn't.
Speaker B:And I was like, huh?
Speaker A:This is what pissed me off about that.
Speaker A:I understand Athena working a case to avoid and to cope and to actually even work through her grief.
Speaker B:That's in character.
Speaker A:That's just who she is as a person to do this specific case.
Speaker A:He's actually dead.
Speaker A:Which is what you're telling us and what I'm assuming until you show me Bobby again.
Speaker A:If you show me Bobby again.
Speaker A:This is fucked up, guys.
Speaker A:I'm sorry.
Speaker A:It is.
Speaker A:It's fucked up.
Speaker C:Why.
Speaker A:Why was this the case that she had to do to, like, give the audience hope that entire episode and.
Speaker A:Because most of the episode was that case.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Like, and then.
Speaker B:And then they, like, yanked that hope away.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:And they.
Speaker B:They utilized it in a way to, like, get Athena to try to start in the acceptance stage.
Speaker B:But it was.
Speaker B:It was just so such a weird, like.
Speaker B:Like stark flip flop to me.
Speaker B:And I was like, just wait.
Speaker A:If you want.
Speaker A:If you are trying to tell a story where you actually want your audience to think that Bobby is dead because he is dead, then you're doing a really bad job.
Speaker A:You're doing a really bad job and you are not doing a good job of not only making everyone who's watching, like, see that he's actually dead.
Speaker A:It feels like we're like, people are being mocked, even people who don't think he's still alive.
Speaker A:Like, I'm sure there were general audience members that were watching that going, what?
Speaker A:Like, I told TJ about the plot and he was like, oh, my God.
Speaker A:And then he still wasn't alive.
Speaker B:Yeah, like, yeah, like, for any.
Speaker B:Any kind of viewer, like ga.
Speaker B:Whatever the heck we are, like, it sets up an expectation.
Speaker B:I Don't know what to call us.
Speaker B:It sets up an expectation and then it does that switcheroo fake out thing.
Speaker B:But I don't think that kind of fake out is in good faith.
Speaker B:Does that make sense?
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:A fake out is, is fun if.
Speaker A:If it's in the direction of, oh, a thing is good, not fake out.
Speaker A:And oh, you think there's hope for something.
Speaker A:And we're taking.
Speaker A:Listen, we all live in the real world.
Speaker A:We, we.
Speaker A:We have that.
Speaker A:We're good.
Speaker A:It just kind of feels like.
Speaker A:It just kind of feels like they're toying with the audience in like a bad way, not in like a fun way.
Speaker A:And I don't know, it's just really if he's actually dead.
Speaker A:And again, like I said, I'm believing it.
Speaker A:I don't, I don't think this is being done.
Speaker A:Well, you didn't, didn't honor his memory.
Speaker A:You didn't honor the characters who all loved him and their grief.
Speaker B:I mean, we still have a little more to go with that.
Speaker B:So, like, I'm willing to hold it from judgment, but like, I get it.
Speaker B:But the episode where in this episode.
Speaker A:Memorialize him, like, no, it just doesn't work for me.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:So I guess like in, in that sense also, like, how little time was actually dedicated to Bobby in 15 and 16, because in 15 we had the, the chasing down of Moira, and then in 16 we had Athena and her case we already talked about.
Speaker B:Like, it makes sense for Athena.
Speaker B:However, there was a lot of time dedicated to it.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker C:I know where we could have shaved some minutes off that ass helicopter.
Speaker A:I watched it on two times speed today, and I still was like, why is this so, so slow?
Speaker A:This is the world's slowest chase.
Speaker C:It really could have been cut in half.
Speaker C:I'm gonna tell you that right now.
Speaker C:The fact that it was supposed to be four minutes, I'm like, bro, they.
Speaker B:Could have sped it up a little.
Speaker C:Honestly, they could have stopped torturing the.
Speaker C:The residents of la, you know, in half the time.
Speaker C:That's all I'm saying.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Okay, here's here.
Speaker A:I will read this part of this.
Speaker B:Tumblr post by Red Rosie Diaz.
Speaker A:Red.
Speaker A:Thank you.
Speaker A:It's like that thing where they have the letters in the wrong place and the person, the dumb person is always reading it incorrectly.
Speaker A:That's me.
Speaker A:But yeah, Red Rosie Diaz on Tumblr has a post about, like, what the episode should have done.
Speaker A:And I think we covered a lot of it, but here's kind of like the TLDR and it's about what you want.
Speaker A:The audience should be feeling.
Speaker A:Yes, the character should be feeling.
Speaker A:But the, the show is for the audience.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:And so the, you're supposed to make the audience feel things.
Speaker A:Not just anything, like you're trying to evoke certain emotions.
Speaker A:So the end of what they said is you, you say you want to shake up the show and make it feel real, then make it feel real.
Speaker A:Let us, the audience, actually feel something during these scenes.
Speaker A:This could have been such a visceral, deeply moving episode, but it wasn't.
Speaker A:And I'm so mad about that.
Speaker A:Insane.
Speaker B:Their, their post is kind of what we, what we were talking about.
Speaker B:Like it should have been dedicated to the personal stories of each of these characters and their relationship with, with Bobby.
Speaker B:And we, we didn't get that.
Speaker B:Like, like, no eulogies, no like sharing of memories or anything like that.
Speaker A:So like Gerard got it.
Speaker B:Yeah, that was weird.
Speaker B:Gerard got more of a speech about Bobby than any of our main.
Speaker A:Had more speaking lines in this episode than Eddie.
Speaker B:That was, that was a little weird.
Speaker B:I thought Brian Thompson, who plays Gerard, he's.
Speaker C:I love Brian Thompson.
Speaker B:So he's so great.
Speaker A:I love Brian Thompson.
Speaker A:But fucking why, but why Gerard?
Speaker A:Do you need to spend this time on Gerard?
Speaker C:Anyway, anyway, yeah, so I agree with the whole make the audience feel something.
Speaker C:The fact that I couldn't even have the proper reaction to these episodes.
Speaker C:I mean, I already kind of figured out why after watching it again, finally for the first time, kind of figured it out why.
Speaker C:But when I was watching 14, 15 and 16, I was like so angry.
Speaker C:If no one knows this, I was so angry that I could not shed a fucking tear because I know that's what I would have done.
Speaker C:And it just, just watching those episodes and with all, basically with our whole laundry list of issues that we had have, like one of the things that I, I, I do feel is like it felt, I guess, kind of empty for me.
Speaker C:So the fact that I have to re watch it to actually feel something, I mean that's, it shouldn't, that shouldn't have been something that I shouldn't have experienced it that way.
Speaker A:Yeah, I felt even less when I rewatched it because I'm even angrier.
Speaker B:Yeah, I was, I was angry when I breezed through everything on two times speed.
Speaker B:But I'm also just a very sentimental person.
Speaker B:So if someone is on screen crying, then I'm crying too.
Speaker A:I'm a cancer.
Speaker A:Do you know how easy it should be to make me cry when you tell good stories?
Speaker A:It should be very easy.
Speaker A:Like, even though I hated how Bobby died, how that was, that he died at all, and how it was handled, how it was written, you still could have moved me with this episode.
Speaker A:And the only thing that moved me was the acting.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:I was sad because it was sad.
Speaker B:Like that was it.
Speaker B:Well, I was sad for the character.
Speaker B:Never mind.
Speaker B:Yeah, I just, I just bawled like a little baby.
Speaker B:So maybe I don't have a leg to stand on here, but like, if.
Speaker A:You'Re gonna hurt me, do it.
Speaker A:Hurt me.
Speaker A:Make me cry.
Speaker A:Make it worth it.
Speaker B:Okay, so I think that's what didn't work for us pretty obviously.
Speaker B:Shall we just talk a little, a little, little bit about some of these behind the scenes production type of things?
Speaker B:Namely, namely being the elephant in the room of those big ass leaks.
Speaker B:And how just factually the funeral procession was in a very busy, like they shut down a very busy street in downtown LA.
Speaker B:Some guy was streaming it live on TikTok.
Speaker B:So we all saw it as it was me.
Speaker B:Also, if you're that guy, fuck you, Fuck you.
Speaker A:You're a creep.
Speaker B:It was not a good time.
Speaker B:But also like we, we couldn't not watch because like curiosity.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:But just the fact that it was so public and such a huge like spoiler.
Speaker B:Huge spoiler.
Speaker B:Very disappointing that they couldn't figure out a way to do it.
Speaker B:I know I said I liked the scale, but like you didn't necessarily have to go that big.
Speaker B:You could have probably found a way to do it with like either a smaller street or on a large soundstage sort of situation.
Speaker B:Cgi.
Speaker B:I don't know.
Speaker B:But that was a big, that was a big spoiler and I think that did impact a lot of people's viewing experience.
Speaker B:Experience of the episodes.
Speaker B:Yes, absolutely.
Speaker B:Because we saw that that was on March 30th and episode 14, it was April 10th.
Speaker B:Oh yeah.
Speaker B:So like as we're going into this arc, this two part arc that we know is going to be a big emergency, we're like, oh, got it.
Speaker B:And then you also have two days later on April 1 for the eagle eyed people on social medias and phantom spaces.
Speaker A:The.
Speaker A:Or just anyone who sees all the reposts of the screenshots they take of his post.
Speaker B:Yeah, the, the script leaks because.
Speaker B:And, and it's weird because there were two instances of that because it was Jennifer Love Hewitt put like a photo on Instagram and she had like their script on her vanity.
Speaker B:But like it was far away and you couldn't really tell what it was.
Speaker B:You could see that there were lines and stuff like that.
Speaker B:But then Oliver's video where it like panned up from the page of a script to.
Speaker B:To Aisha, which who can we.
Speaker B:How can we say whether it was intentional or not intentional?
Speaker B:I don't think we'll ever be able to say decisively until somebody confirms or denies.
Speaker B:But even then, like, how can you trust that?
Speaker B:You know, so, so like with, with that like very brief like snapshot from the video, people were then able to like line that up to like Jennifer Love Hewitt's like, like blow it like enhanced, you know, because there's nothing that you could have really seen in her picture.
Speaker B:But like the two of them together, then you can start putting.
Speaker A:They compare that it.
Speaker A:It was the same.
Speaker C:And then they.
Speaker A:And then they.
Speaker A:Someone basically put together the page constructed but like with blacked out spaces where you couldn't make out the words.
Speaker A:And the three quarters of that page is exactly what happened in the final scene.
Speaker A:It's like exactly like word for word.
Speaker B:With Athena man, what you can see with Athena Manha in the cemetery.
Speaker A:And then at the end of that, the very last thing it says, which was supposed to be the end of the episode.
Speaker A:Like in the script 16 or 16 is Bobby, is Maddie answering?
Speaker A:Hello, 91 1, what's your emergency?
Speaker A:And Bobby saying, I'm being buried alive.
Speaker B:Which also really affected the viewing experience for people.
Speaker B:And I don't even care if like you just set your expectations so, so high.
Speaker B:It's just like anything like that is going to a cast even more doubt than like what's already textually inside your show.
Speaker B:And the only reason I wanted to bring up the script leaks because it's so like, it's almost like hearsay because you don't know, like if it's.
Speaker B:If it's a fake script, if it was a prank, if it was like intentionally leaked or not, is because someone asked Tim about it in an interview where he was giving definitive answers about stuff from after 15 where it was like, why he decided to kill off Bobby.
Speaker B:Why when they decided to do that, like all of this stuff, he was giving definitive answers.
Speaker B:And the interviewer asked him, well, what about the.
Speaker B:The script leaks?
Speaker B:Or they even asked him about the.
Speaker B:The funeral procession leak.
Speaker B:And he was like, we were just dumb and didn't.
Speaker B:Didn't think about it.
Speaker B:To which I'm like, sure, okay.
Speaker B:But then the interviewer also asked about the script leaks.
Speaker B:And that is the only question that Tim evaded with, like, I don't know anything about that.
Speaker B:So I just bring it up just for that again, that obviously everything that we.
Speaker B:That people were able to figure out up to a certain point in those lines was in the episode.
Speaker B:So it's like, is this something that will maybe be move to another episode?
Speaker B:Or was it just a prank or was it deleted?
Speaker A:I was just gonna say we're new here, but we already know just from our own experience and from learning our fandom history, which we always do when we join a fandom, that this show can't keep a secret to save its life.
Speaker B:No.
Speaker A:So the fact that.
Speaker A:That's a well known fact.
Speaker A:It's like if you wanted to keep stuff secret, you know how to know what you shouldn't do, which is film a giant procession out on Flower, which is one of the busiest streets in la.
Speaker A:And then maybe you shouldn't be posting on social media with the scripts and like, I.
Speaker A:I don't know what the intention was.
Speaker A:And I'm not mad at the actors for doing this.
Speaker B:No, not at all.
Speaker A:I don't.
Speaker B:I want to make sure.
Speaker A:I'm not mad at the actors for any of this.
Speaker A:I want to make.
Speaker A:Make sure it's clear all of my ire if this.
Speaker A:If Bobby's actually perma dead, which I think he has all of my ire for.
Speaker A:Like, how this has just been handled, like, PR wise.
Speaker A:Is that Tim?
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:I don't.
Speaker A:I don't hold any animosity towards the cast, but it's just like, why would you post that if it's not.
Speaker A:It's just all of it's been so weird.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Just the way that it's been handled PR wise.
Speaker A:Why isn't Peter Krause, like, giving interviews, exit interviews.
Speaker A:Like, I know he's in the rest of the season, like, as a force ghost or hallucinations, whatever the.
Speaker A:Why isn't he giving interviews?
Speaker A:They're just so weird.
Speaker A:Anyway, I have three needle drops if we're done with the leaks.
Speaker A:Okay.
Speaker A:Really quick couple needle drops in 8, 14.
Speaker A:When chimney starts coughing up blood.
Speaker A:Right before it cuts to commercial, they play My Body Is a Cage by Peter Graybrohl.
Speaker A:And the lyrics, most notably from that song are.
Speaker A:My body is a cage that keeps me from dancing with the one I love but my mind holds the key.
Speaker A:Would have been a great setup if this was a chimney coma dream.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker A:Why the fuck was it here otherwise?
Speaker A:Sorry.
Speaker A:Why?
Speaker B:It's also a good song.
Speaker B:These are all good.
Speaker A:It is a great song.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And we have High and Dry by Radiohead, which was playing an A15 at the end when it's like.
Speaker A:It's a weird song to play if it is a triumphant moment, which is how, when it started playing, I was like, well, didn't.
Speaker B:Last time, Chimney had.
Speaker B:When Chimney had his coma dream after he got stabbed by Doug, didn't they play another Radiohead song?
Speaker B:So, like.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker B:So I was.
Speaker B:I was still.
Speaker B:At this point, we were so young and naive.
Speaker B:I was still like, oh, Radiohead.
Speaker B:Connecting to the Radiohead of.
Speaker A:Sure.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:I'm not saying erasing it from, like, coma dream.
Speaker A:I'm saying, like, once that started playing, I knew that Bobby was dead because I was like, oh, everyone's seemingly okay, but we're playing High and Dry by Radiohead, which is.
Speaker A:Don't leave me high don't leave me dry.
Speaker A:The best thing you've had has gone away.
Speaker B:That's not a fun, happy song.
Speaker B:No, no.
Speaker B:Good song.
Speaker B:The most egregious.
Speaker A:The most egregious.
Speaker A:Which, again, operating off the assumption that Bobby is actually dead, if he's not.
Speaker A:Perfect choice.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:He's really dead.
Speaker A:What the fuck?
Speaker B:I love that we get Hozier in this show.
Speaker B:I hated how we got there.
Speaker A:I.
Speaker A:I'm so sorry.
Speaker A:Just like, no grave can hold my body down.
Speaker A:I'll call him to her.
Speaker B:This is work song by Hozier, by the way.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker B:Sorry.
Speaker A:Work song by Hozier.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker A:It's going to be ruined for me a little bit.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker A:If Bobby is permade, which I again think he is, that'll be so, like, we're supposed to go see.
Speaker A:We are going to go see Hozier in September.
Speaker B:I thought about that and I was like.
Speaker A:I was like, no, he's actually really dead.
Speaker A:I'm not going to be okay.
Speaker A:Like, Rachel and I are going to be just, like, sobbing onto each other, and Nikki's just gonna be like.
Speaker B:Like they're there.
Speaker B:Like Baymax.
Speaker B:Like, they're there.
Speaker B:Oh, yeah, yeah.
Speaker A:With a broom.
Speaker B:It's like.
Speaker B:It's like, finally.
Speaker B:I've been trying to go see Hozier for forever, and then I'm like, amazing.
Speaker B:Finally get to see Hozier.
Speaker B:Now one of his songs is ruined.
Speaker A:Yep.
Speaker B:One of the best songs.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:No grave can hold my body down.
Speaker B:What is that supposed to mean?
Speaker A:If he's actually dead, we should have used Francesca.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker A:Which is a person being dead.
Speaker A:But, like, if they asked me at the end, if I was given the choice, I'd tell them, put me back in it.
Speaker B:Like, I go do it again.
Speaker A:All the bad and the good again.
Speaker B:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker B:That would be a definitive thing.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Anyway, that's it.
Speaker B:All right.
Speaker B:So I know, I know we've kind of gone into a little bit of like the looking forward and, and granted we know this episode is going to come out the day that the finale.
Speaker A:Finale.
Speaker B:The finale airs.
Speaker B:So like, like you, you listening to this now will have seen episode 17.
Speaker B:We recording this now have not.
Speaker B:So this is our.
Speaker A:It's Sunday.
Speaker A:We have four days.
Speaker B:Oh great.
Speaker B:Can I have another two week?
Speaker B:I hate it.
Speaker A:I.
Speaker A:I need.
Speaker B:No, I need this.
Speaker A:I need the old yeller me for, for the summer.
Speaker A:Okay.
Speaker A:I need my three month break.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:So.
Speaker C:So this is our begging.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:So this is our.
Speaker B:What we know about what's coming next, like who knows?
Speaker B:But there are more episodes technically.
Speaker B:So here's what we have.
Speaker B:So because, because we always try to look forward a little bit.
Speaker B:So we have 8:17, which is don't drink the water.
Speaker B:It's going to air on May 8th.
Speaker B:The synopsis that we have.
Speaker B:Wait, do you have the alternative synopsis?
Speaker B:I'm looking for it.
Speaker B:Okay, the.
Speaker B:The first synopsis that we got was following an earthquake.
Speaker B:The 118 races to the scene of several unusual fires and must figure out their cause before anyone else is hurt.
Speaker B:Meanwhile, as everyone settles into their new normal, they try to move forward and plan for the future.
Speaker B:And I think they just released an alternate synopsis.
Speaker B:All right, so the alternate synopsis is an earthquake contaminates an LA water supply, sparking several unusual and fiery 911 calls.
Speaker B:Meanwhile, Buck contemplates where he's supposed to be and Chim and Maddie prepare for the baby, which is a very different synopsis.
Speaker B:But okay, so basically what we know from looking at the promo, the methane make fire on water and hen doesn't want to be captain.
Speaker B:Maybe.
Speaker B:But also there's no hen in that alternate synopsis.
Speaker B:And that's all we know.
Speaker B:Well, you'll have seen it by the time you hear this, so let us know.
Speaker B:And then we have the finale of season eight episode, episode 18, which is called Seismic Shifts.
Speaker B:It will air on May 15th.
Speaker B:We got no synopsis, but we know there's an earthquake obviously also seismic.
Speaker B:So that's a given.
Speaker B:Looks like from some behind the scenes photos.
Speaker B:There's a building collapse probably.
Speaker B:So it's giving season two.
Speaker A:That's all is it?
Speaker A:It is.
Speaker B:That's all we know.
Speaker B:I guess we'll find out tonight or whenever you have heard this.
Speaker B:And then just like generally things that we know are gonna come up is they're gonna hopefully potentially be focusing more on different characters, like grief arcs, I guess.
Speaker B:And who's gonna be the captain now?
Speaker B:But also probably not figure that out until season nine.
Speaker B:Who knows?
Speaker C:No.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker C:Because Tim doesn't have a plan.
Speaker C:He said that he doesn't know either, so who knows?
Speaker B:That's all we know.
Speaker A:Anyway, this is our wish list.
Speaker B:Things that we would like to see in these last two episodes.
Speaker C:Probably not dead.
Speaker B:Take it back, Eddie, my boy, on our screens.
Speaker A:Like, we're begging you to let him out of the closet.
Speaker A:I'm just like, just let him be there.
Speaker A:Just put the repressed version on my screen.
Speaker A:I don't care.
Speaker B:Take it anywhere you can get it at this point, like Butters on the floor.
Speaker C:But fix his hair.
Speaker C:I.
Speaker C:Please just make sure the strand.
Speaker B:Oh, it was because.
Speaker A:Because I know he tightened up.
Speaker C:I don't.
Speaker A:Curling in himself because grief don't care.
Speaker C:Fix that, Mrs.
Speaker C:Fruity Hair, preferably.
Speaker B:We would like for Bobby to actually be alive and then he can retire happily.
Speaker A:Yes, please.
Speaker A:Because I don't think if he is alive, that he's just coming back.
Speaker A:No.
Speaker A:As the captain.
Speaker B:No.
Speaker B:And then that's okay.
Speaker A:That's fine.
Speaker B:Totally fine.
Speaker B:I just want him alive.
Speaker B:I want him around, I want him.
Speaker A:Alive, and I want him as a guest star.
Speaker B:Bobby can be off screen sometimes.
Speaker B:Most of the time, even.
Speaker B:I'm okay with that.
Speaker A:Give him the Eddie Diaz treatment.
Speaker A:Swap their screen time.
Speaker B:Like, literally.
Speaker B:I just want Bobby to be around.
Speaker A:One in every four episodes.
Speaker B:Have him show up in, like, the season nine premiere and, like, a couple episodes and then the finale, and then just, like, you know, they can pretend to talk to.
Speaker B:To him on the phone.
Speaker B:Yeah, well, the characters can actually talk to him, but they don't have to, like, bring him in.
Speaker B:And.
Speaker A:Yeah, you know, here's my specific wish list or, like, rumination.
Speaker A:I have three scenarios in which I would like to see the captain situation play out.
Speaker A:And spoiler alert, none of them are Buck being captain, because I don't want that right now.
Speaker A:Literally no one wants that.
Speaker A:Stop trying to make fetch happen.
Speaker A:Okay.
Speaker A:I think everyone thinks slash or wants it to happen closer to the end of the series.
Speaker B:Not at the literal last episode, but, like.
Speaker A:No.
Speaker B:Maybe the last season or two.
Speaker A:Yeah, but there's been no, like, growth in his career to, like, make.
Speaker A:Make us feel like that's a natural progression right now.
Speaker B:Which is why, like, I pointed out some of those little crumbs that they were dropping earlier.
Speaker B:So it, like, I get it, but, like, but also the rest of the.
Speaker A:Season, it's always like, bobby, should I do this, Bobby?
Speaker A:What should I do, Bobby?
Speaker B:Well, I.
Speaker B:I know that.
Speaker B:And I'm saying, like, I think dropping these crumbs is how it should continue.
Speaker A:Oh.
Speaker B:Or longer.
Speaker B:Like, I have no problem of them building that up, but extend that build up, you know, like not just a couple little nuggets here and there and then boom.
Speaker B:No, because.
Speaker B:Because he's not.
Speaker B:He's not fully cooked yet.
Speaker A:No, like, put him back in the oven.
Speaker B:Keep that building, keep that momentum in that aspect.
Speaker A:He's raw cookie dough.
Speaker A:If you make us eat him as captain right now, we're gonna get salmonella and the bird flu.
Speaker A:Anyway, anyway, here's, Here's.
Speaker A:I think the ideal scenario that Syl and I came up with in a two hour conversation.
Speaker B:I missed that one.
Speaker C:It was during the day.
Speaker C:Rachel, you were not awake.
Speaker A:You were still asleep.
Speaker A:Certainly Hannah's captain and his captain.
Speaker B:Yay.
Speaker A:Chimney and Eddie are paramedic partners.
Speaker A:And then Robbie and Buck, heavy rescue partners.
Speaker A:Because, yes, this allows the most change.
Speaker A:The most change.
Speaker A:And we put someone as captain who has experience but hasn't really had a shot at it.
Speaker A:That isn't, like, traumatic.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker C:She gets to have a redo.
Speaker C:Yes.
Speaker C:Which I think she deserves.
Speaker A:Yes, she really does.
Speaker A:And I think that she's the only person that's like, mentally prepared to do that right now.
Speaker A:To also just like a black lesbian woman fire captain.
Speaker A:Give it to me, Rachel.
Speaker A:There you go.
Speaker A:That.
Speaker A:Thank you.
Speaker B:If it were.
Speaker B:If it was in my power, I would absolutely.
Speaker B:Because, like, that.
Speaker B:That is the best, like, kind of scenario.
Speaker B:Because then.
Speaker B:Then you have Chimney and Eddie being partners because hen is obviously not there.
Speaker A:And you get in and we can have set up that bestieism because we're setting.
Speaker B:I.
Speaker A:Yes, I have.
Speaker A:I have this.
Speaker B:Well, this is how we get, like.
Speaker C:We get Eddie and Maddie in the same room together.
Speaker A:True.
Speaker B:Also that.
Speaker B:Okay.
Speaker A:But I was.
Speaker A:I was going for, like, they're very clearly, like, setting up Ravi and Buck as, like, the new.
Speaker A:Well, not the new.
Speaker A:There were never platonic best friends as platonic besties.
Speaker A:And I think that they should do the same thing for Eddie with Chim.
Speaker B:And that's also.
Speaker A:So.
Speaker B:Also just an tangent about how they have been setting up Buck and Ravi as friends.
Speaker B:Because then you'll also see the difference between, you know, a regular friendship and.
Speaker B:And Buck will.
Speaker B:Buck will also see a difference between regular friendship with Ravi and whatever they have going on between him and Eddie.
Speaker B:So, like, you'll be able to compare contrast there.
Speaker B:And the characters will compare and contrast there too.
Speaker B:And Eddie too.
Speaker B:Eddie's never had a best friend either, so.
Speaker A:Well, Shannon.
Speaker A:True Shannon.
Speaker B:Well, okay.
Speaker B:So his only other best friend he was romantically involved with.
Speaker A:So here's, I think my second.
Speaker A:My second best choice still.
Speaker A:Is this your second best choice too?
Speaker A:Do you agree with this one?
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker A:Okay, Eddie, Captain.
Speaker A:We know this is not happening, but don't get mad.
Speaker B:Hail Mary.
Speaker A:We think he'd be a really great captain, actually.
Speaker A:He'd be incredible at it.
Speaker A:Eddie, Captain, Hen and Chimney partners, and Buck and Robbie partners.
Speaker A:Not as much change up, but like it is.
Speaker A:Would be a lot for Eddie.
Speaker A:And also add a benefit of way more screen time for Eddie because, like, what are you gonna do?
Speaker A:Just have calls where he's not there?
Speaker A:No, you can.
Speaker A:He's the captain.
Speaker B:It'd be a pay raise for him.
Speaker B:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker A:Because he is like broke as.
Speaker A:Okay, this is like, I guess, last ditch effort option.
Speaker A:Chimney is captain.
Speaker A:That man does not want to be captain.
Speaker B:Absolutely not.
Speaker C:No.
Speaker A:That man hated being captain.
Speaker A:But he, He.
Speaker A:He can do it.
Speaker A:We know he can.
Speaker B:He would be a good captain.
Speaker B:He just doesn't want it.
Speaker A:He just doesn't want to.
Speaker A:And I don't think we should make him do it.
Speaker A:But if we must to keep Buck from doing it, then sure, fine, whatever.
Speaker A:Then we're doing Hen and Robbie partners.
Speaker A:Because I think that would be super fun and seeing Robbie become a paramedic.
Speaker A:And then we can keep bucking Eddie as partners, which you're like, that's not a change.
Speaker A:But it is if they're starting to get romantically involved and then have to still be partners.
Speaker B:Can I put an alternate in here as well?
Speaker A:Sure.
Speaker B:Because then if you have Hen and Eddie be partners.
Speaker A:No, they're terrible partners.
Speaker A:Okay, we already saw that.
Speaker B:All right.
Speaker B:Oh, I see where you're going with.
Speaker A:It for, like the gay stuff.
Speaker A:So.
Speaker A:Sure, Temporary partners.
Speaker B:Friends than them work partners.
Speaker A:But they're.
Speaker A:They did not work well as partners.
Speaker B:No, I do remember that now.
Speaker B:Yep.
Speaker B:Never mind.
Speaker A:Yeah, it was real bad.
Speaker A:And they.
Speaker A:They both got mad at each other because it was like.
Speaker A:Yeah, it was like they were looking at each other like, why aren't you chimney?
Speaker A:Why aren't you Buck?
Speaker A:Like, why aren't you reading my mind?
Speaker B:You're correct.
Speaker B:You have already figured that out.
Speaker B:I'm so sorry for interjecting, so sorry for having thoughts, but I.
Speaker B:I get your thought process.
Speaker B:Yeah, that does make sense.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Yeah, I like that.
Speaker A:Anyway, here Are the options.
Speaker A:Hopefully one of these is coming to fruition.
Speaker C:Or they're giving.
Speaker C:Or they're giving us a new character.
Speaker C:I don't.
Speaker A:I literally would rather have Buck as captain than a new character.
Speaker A:I'm gonna be so fucking for real with you.
Speaker A:I do not want a new character because I want Ravi to be a man.
Speaker A:And I do not want any less screen time for anyone there, especially Eddie.
Speaker A:I know.
Speaker A:I'm not gonna shut up about it.
Speaker A:I'm not.
Speaker B:We wouldn't ask you to.
Speaker A:I feel like I've been patient all season, and now there's two episodes left, and I've had, like, four sentences from this man for the past month and a half.
Speaker A:So now I'm angry, I'm grumpy.
Speaker C:Makes sense.
Speaker A:Quanky.
Speaker B:I guess my other.
Speaker B:My only other wish list item is with the earthquake or building collapse or something.
Speaker B:Something.
Speaker B:I have said this multiple times.
Speaker B:Some sort of, like, Buck and Eddie being not necessarily an nde.
Speaker B:Like, they don't have to be mortally wounded.
Speaker B:They can just be trapped.
Speaker B:It's okay.
Speaker B:They can be.
Speaker B:Not hurt.
Speaker B:They can be not hurt.
Speaker B:I want to make that very clear.
Speaker C:But just.
Speaker B:Just unable to extricate themselves.
Speaker C:I really hope that.
Speaker C:Because I.
Speaker B:Because we.
Speaker C:We do know.
Speaker C:What we do know is that they are filming on this.
Speaker C:In this location.
Speaker C:Any rude.
Speaker C:Any rude.
Speaker C:Ryan and Oliver were in this one location where it looks like it's a building collapse.
Speaker C:And I'm just like, can.
Speaker A:If.
Speaker C:If we're going to do this, can.
Speaker B:We just have the.
Speaker C:Can we have Buck and Eddie trapped in a.
Speaker C:Because I'm.
Speaker C:This is.
Speaker C:This is where I get concerned.
Speaker C:Because, like.
Speaker C:Like, we really do need a.
Speaker C:A buddy moment to end this season.
Speaker C:We really need it.
Speaker C:Like, come on.
Speaker C:What are we doing?
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker C:So having.
Speaker C:Having.
Speaker A:I don't know, maybe Robbie's the one rescuing them.
Speaker C:That's what I'm hoping that.
Speaker C:Yeah, well, that's what I hope.
Speaker A:They're all trapped together.
Speaker A:It's potential for another fan fiction moment.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker C:I thought you guys were married.
Speaker A:I thought you guys were.
Speaker A:I thought you guys were exes or.
Speaker B:Like, which I would totally accept.
Speaker B:I kind of keep thinking of it as, like, almost like a chamber of secrets moment, you know, when, like, Harry and Ron and Gildrey Lockhart go down, but then, like, it collapses and it separates.
Speaker B:So, like, Ravi could be there with them, but on the other side.
Speaker B:And he's able to go get help, but then Buck and Eddie are kind of stuck.
Speaker B:So, like, they've all been trapped, but.
Speaker B:And I've been saying this for months.
Speaker B:Like, I.
Speaker B:I want.
Speaker B:I want Buddy trapped because they need to talk to each other.
Speaker B:And this could be anything from, like, you know, blowing up with his grief.
Speaker B:It could be them actually talking to each other about literally anything.
Speaker B:Just have the conversation because there's nothing else to do.
Speaker A:And I'm not talking, Rachel.
Speaker B:And I'm not talking about.
Speaker A:To be, one has to be hurt.
Speaker A:It's not going to happen.
Speaker B:Hurt is fine.
Speaker B:I'm not talking about mortally wounded, like, like on the brink of death.
Speaker B:Nde.
Speaker B:I'm just like, maybe one of them has, like, a sprained ankle.
Speaker A:That's not what I mean either, and you know it.
Speaker A:I don't think that they're going to, like, have an open conversation or that they're going to write them having an open conversation without one of them.
Speaker A:And listen, I'm fine with an nde.
Speaker A:Make them conscious for it.
Speaker A:Just don't have them pass out, because then what the fuck is.
Speaker B:What's the point?
Speaker B:They have to be conscious.
Speaker B:They have to be forced to talk to each other.
Speaker B:Actually, not particular on specifics, but like.
Speaker A:Or one of them can realize and.
Speaker A:Or confess something, and that's where.
Speaker A:And then they can pass out.
Speaker C:And that's where I'm thinking, like, there's a big emphasis on saying I love you to people much more often.
Speaker C:And it's gonna be Buck.
Speaker A:He's gonna say it and then pass out.
Speaker C:It's going to be Buck.
Speaker C:It's going to be Buck.
Speaker B:And.
Speaker C:And.
Speaker C:And it's really because Maddie is the one who, like, brought up the idea.
Speaker C:And Maddie has been the person who's slowly but surely guiding Buck in the right direction about who his love, the love of his life is.
Speaker C:But, you know, this ain't that one.
Speaker B:My God.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Like, for real.
Speaker C:So, like.
Speaker C:And the other piece of evidence to that is the whole, you know, Bobby saying I love you, kid, and Buckn up.
Speaker C:Really was in shock not being able to say it back.
Speaker C:So you have a missed opportunity and then you have your sister introducing that idea or that lesson to you.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:On top, thinking about what he would want to hear.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker A:If Eddie were.
Speaker A:You know.
Speaker A:You know what I mean?
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Because he knows what he would have wanted to hear.
Speaker B:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker C:We could.
Speaker C:And to my point, because I did write a whole thread about this, I don't think it.
Speaker C:It doesn't have to be like, if.
Speaker C:If this is something that comes out from Buck.
Speaker C:That does not have to be necessarily something that is considered, like, I Guess like a.
Speaker C:A hint or a.
Speaker C:Or like a.
Speaker C:What did I say?
Speaker C:Please hold.
Speaker A:Holding.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:These are the only things that I wish for the last two episodes.
Speaker B:The bar is kind of on the floor at the moment.
Speaker B:I really hate say, like, admitting that, but, like, I'm willing to accept they're.
Speaker A:Gonna hate to see me coming if they just drop what they've been setting up for Buck and Eddie this entire season.
Speaker A:They're gonna hate to see me coming all hiatus.
Speaker B:I don't look forward to that version of these three months.
Speaker A:I don't either.
Speaker A:I don't want to do that.
Speaker A:I want joy.
Speaker B:We deserve joy.
Speaker B:We deserve.
Speaker A:Or I like angst.
Speaker A:Give me angst, but don't just, like, drop it.
Speaker B:Like, give us some.
Speaker B:Literally just something.
Speaker A:This is why I'm like, I really just, like, I wish Bobby was alive because then I could stop having all of these doubts.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:So anyway, what I was trying to say is, like, the.
Speaker C:The act of.
Speaker C:Of maybe Buck saying I love you doesn't really have to be considered, like, a romantic.
Speaker C:Romantic I love you, but it would be to his potential romantic interest.
Speaker C:You know what I mean?
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker C:So it's still.
Speaker C:It's still valid.
Speaker C:But I also think what I.
Speaker C:What I had said in the thread that I.
Speaker C:That I had typed out on Twitter was kind of like.
Speaker C:It also doesn't have to feel like he's making the first move or he's making the.
Speaker C:The act of choosing someone.
Speaker C:And I think, really, this was in response to some discord.
Speaker C:Not discord.
Speaker C:Sorry.
Speaker C:Discourse on Twitter, because people were going crazy about the whole.
Speaker B:About who should be choosing and chosen.
Speaker A:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker C:I don't know.
Speaker B:It's mutually.
Speaker B:It's mutually both ways.
Speaker A:Yay.
Speaker C:So, yeah, this is.
Speaker C:That's what I want.
Speaker C:Just.
Speaker C:Just say it.
Speaker C:And.
Speaker C:And bonk him.
Speaker B:And.
Speaker C:And it's perfect because, like, it would bonk him in the head.
Speaker C:It would bonk Eddie in the head.
Speaker B:Shut up.
Speaker B:It would.
Speaker A:And then it would give us the Eddie moment that we've been saying we thought we were gonna get.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Which I still.
Speaker B:I still want, but I kind of want us to leave on a cliffhanger of Bobby more now.
Speaker B:Like you.
Speaker C:I closed.
Speaker C:So this is where I'm weakness is where I'm at.
Speaker B:That's.
Speaker C:No, but it really, really.
Speaker C:It goes.
Speaker C:Sorry, one more thing.
Speaker C:Listen, I'm passionate about this.
Speaker A:One more.
Speaker C:Thing, because it'll just bonk him in the head with love.
Speaker C:Because clearly, even, like, your actions.
Speaker C:And I know he understands that your actions are because you.
Speaker C:He loves you.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:Like, speaking Eddie over here.
Speaker C:But, like, he's so in, like, this.
Speaker C:This whole mental state of feeling undeserving and that I think he really just at this point, needs to hear the words.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker C:So.
Speaker A:Yes, you're correct.
Speaker A:So I think maybe we could or should get a parallel to after the lightning kitchen talk.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker A:When he's asking Eddie what he remembers about the shooting.
Speaker A:So if it's Buck or.
Speaker A:Yeah, if it's Buck, that would be a great mirror.
Speaker A:Like a great parallel mirror of Eddie being like, what do you remember?
Speaker C:Oh, God.
Speaker C:So it's kind of like adding a little bit of that amnesia fic in.
Speaker A:There, but not, like, just angst.
Speaker A:Because, like, if it is said in a romantic way and Eddie's like, does he remember saying it?
Speaker A:Like, did he mean saying, like, what do you remember about, like, what happened?
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:Like, trying to get him to say it again.
Speaker A:And Buck bucks.
Speaker A:Like, I don't either.
Speaker A:He could either just be like, I don't remember much about it, and.
Speaker A:And lie.
Speaker A:Like Eddie, I think did.
Speaker B:Yeah, I think so, too.
Speaker A:Or he could be honest and be like, I meant it.
Speaker A:Which.
Speaker A:It's Buck, so that might be what he does.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Because also, he can't.
Speaker B:Can't lie to Eddie.
Speaker A:No.
Speaker B:But, like, he'd have to tell the truth.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker A:So it could be like, I meant it.
Speaker B:But don't worry, this changes nothing between us.
Speaker A:If it's romantic.
Speaker A:But don't worry, it changes nothing between us.
Speaker B:And then we get the.
Speaker A:The look into the distance.
Speaker A:But I want, like, the same face that he made in, like, 705.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Where Buck was like, I can't stop thinking about him.
Speaker A:And he made that like, that, like.
Speaker A:Yeah, Well, I hate that face.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Okay.
Speaker B:I'm glad we were able to finish this off on a more positive light.
Speaker A:I can, Buddy Max, in any circumstances.
Speaker B:That is true.
Speaker C:It's the only way to mechanism.
Speaker A:That's.
Speaker A:That's the vision I'm trying to manifest.
Speaker A:I know that this is already filmed.
Speaker A:They already wrapped.
Speaker B:But we're putting it out onto the universe either way.
Speaker A:And if we're writing something right, just know that we're recording this on May 4th.
Speaker B:May the fourth.
Speaker A:May the fourth be with you.
Speaker A:Oh, my God.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker B:And also with you.
Speaker A:I saw.
Speaker B:I saw a meme earlier on Twitter.
Speaker B:It was like.
Speaker B:It was like a Star wars poster.
Speaker B:And then the Conclave post, I was like, yes, this is.
Speaker B:This is the meme of the dreams.
Speaker A:The Jedi Order is pretty culty, so.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Anyways, anyway, thank you so much for joining us through this.
Speaker B:Whatever this was.
Speaker B:The Curse season 8 special.
Speaker C:What are we calling this?
Speaker C:The Curse Happens.
Speaker A:Calling it the Cursed Season eight.
Speaker C:I would.
Speaker A:TJ had an idea for the title.
Speaker A:Oh, he.
Speaker A:Because I read him some of the texts that we were sending to each other, like earlier when we were still on our way home, and I told him that we were calling it Schrodinger's Bobby.
Speaker A:And he was like, that should be the title of your episode.
Speaker B:Even though we tried to be like, no, we're going to do this.
Speaker B:Like, he's dead.
Speaker B:And then I failed at that.
Speaker C:I mean, you did.
Speaker C:Specifically.
Speaker A:You did, you did.
Speaker A:And then I kept feeling the need to emphasize that I do think he's dead.
Speaker A:It is Schrodinger's Bobby.
Speaker A:Because we still talk about, like, how they set it up to make us think that he isn't.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker C:Yes.
Speaker A:So I don't know.
Speaker A:Just an idea.
Speaker B:Yeah, I.
Speaker B:I like that.
Speaker B:Schrodinger's Bobby, first Season eight Special.
Speaker C:Okay.
Speaker C:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker A:Remember, don't kill off the main guy.
Speaker B:But if you do, take a buddy with you.
Speaker A:Thank you for listening to the Buddy System podcast from start to finish.
Speaker C:We literally cannot shut up about 911, so please come talk to us on your favorite social media platform.
Speaker B:We are BuddySystemPod Everywhere.
Speaker B:That's B U D D I E SystemPod.
Speaker A:Leave a five star review on Spotify or Apple podcasts to get a personal shout out in the next episode.
Speaker A:The Buddy System is a nerd Virgin Media production featuring music from Divinity.
Speaker C:Can't get enough of the buddies.
Speaker C:Subscribe to our Patreon for access to exclusive content in our Discord community.
Speaker B:Catch you next time.
Speaker B:And don't forget, bring a buddy with you.
